Paleo Diet: Raw Paleo Diet and Lifestyle Forum
Raw Paleo Diet Forums => Hot Topics => Topic started by: Löwenherz on March 05, 2012, 09:23:47 pm
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German scientist Prof. Harald zur Hausen believes that heat-created toxins are not the main cause for colorectal cancer but viruses in raw beef:
http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/diet-and-fitness/sick-cows-linked-to-cancer-rise-20120214-1t3nn.html (http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/diet-and-fitness/sick-cows-linked-to-cancer-rise-20120214-1t3nn.html)
http://www.focus.de/gesundheit/news/darmkrebs-forscher-vermutet-krebserreger-in-rindfleisch_aid_720424.html (http://www.focus.de/gesundheit/news/darmkrebs-forscher-vermutet-krebserreger-in-rindfleisch_aid_720424.html)
"Previous studies have linked diets high in red meat to CRC. The link has been primarily attributed to exposure to three main families of
carcinogens generated through cooking, processing or curing of meats. However these compounds are also produced when cooking fish and white meat, which do not confer risk of CRC."
Löwenherz
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Please put all such topics in the Hot Topics forum in future. Moved there now.
As regards the above, raw food diets(and cooking at lower temperatures) have all proven effective in significantly reducing all kinds of cancers given past studies, so the claim re raw beef and cancer is clearly wrong.
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Here's the original paper: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22212999 (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22212999)
The available data are compatible with the interpretation that a specific beef factor, suspected to be one or more thermoresistant potentially oncogenic bovine viruses (e.g., polyoma-, papilloma- or possibly single-stranded DNA viruses) may contaminate beef preparations and lead to latent infections in the colorectal tract. Preceding, concomitant or subsequent exposure to chemical carcinogens arising during cooking procedures should result in increased risk for colorectal cancer synergistic with these infections.
So it's still the cooking that messes up. Such a virus infection without exposure to carcinogens produced by cooking won't lead to an increased risk of cancer, according to the abstract.
I would rather think it's some still undiscovered heat-created carcinogen which only happens in beef, rather than some virus.. because we know only how many people eat raw meat, and how many people have this cancer. I just don't see the correlation.
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Here's the original paper: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22212999 (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22212999)So it's still the cooking that messes up. Such a virus infection without exposure to carcinogens produced by cooking won't lead to an increased risk of cancer, according to the abstract.
Sounds logical.
This reminds me that "normal" starch eaters frequently get the flu from viruses (and other demons) and that raw paleo dieters get the virus but no flu. :)
Löwenherz
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... so the claim re raw beef and cancer is clearly wrong.
Sorry, but this is an extreme oversimplification.
As you know, animals in the wild can also get cancer, while eating a life-long 100% raw food diet. That shows that other factors beside cooking can be involved.
Löwenherz
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Here is an interview with Prof. Harald zur Hausen:
http://www.latrobe.edu.au/news/articles/2010/podcasts/a-cure-for-cancer-within-reach/transcript (http://www.latrobe.edu.au/news/articles/2010/podcasts/a-cure-for-cancer-within-reach/transcript)
Löwenherz
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Please put all such topics in the Hot Topics forum in future. Moved there now.
The "Hot Topics forum" is for NON-RAW topics, right?
This is a not a non-raw topic.
Lol,
Löwenherz
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Sorry, but this is an extreme oversimplification.
As you know, animals in the wild can also get cancer, while eating a life-long 100% raw food diet. That shows that other factors beside cooking can be involved.
Löwenherz
You are missing the point. The point I made was that studies have shown LOWER rates of cancer after reducing average cooking temperatures(or higher rates of cancer if cooking temperatures were increased). I did not state that cancer-rates were reduced to 0 after eating only raw foods.
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Does this include all type of beef; grass fed as well? Perhaps they're talking about the grain fed typical beef.
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The "Hot Topics forum" is for NON-RAW topics, right?
This is a not a non-raw topic.
Lol,
Löwenherz
No, the Hot Topics forum is for any topics which are anti-rawpalaeo in theme. Non-dietary related topics go in the Off-Topics forum.
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You are missing the point. The point I made was that studies have shown LOWER rates of cancer after reducing average cooking temperatures(or higher rates of cancer if cooking temperatures were increased). I did not state that cancer-rates were reduced to 0 after eating only raw foods.
You wrote: "..so the claim re raw beef and cancer is clearly wrong."
And I ask you: HOW do YOU know??
You don't have ANY proof that the connection is "clearly wrong".
Nevertheless, you are free to think and speculate what you want.
Löwenherz
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No, the Hot Topics forum is for any topics which are anti-rawpalaeo in theme. Non-dietary related topics go in the Off-Topics forum.
Citing critical articles is not necessarily "anti-rawpaleo".
BTW: Here is the forum description on the main page: "Hot Topics, Discussions of non-RAF/non- raw topics. Raw vegan and Fruitarian topics may be discussed here but only here., Moderator: djr_81"
Löwenherz
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No, the Hot Topics forum is for any topics which are anti-rawpalaeo in theme. Non-dietary related topics go in the Off-Topics forum.
Somehow we seem to have this problem in half the topics that apparently belong in this section. This is a "raw paleo" forum so "non/anti raw paleo" topics are off topic but should be placed in the hot topics section? Confusing. Sounds like the hot topic section should be called "non rpd" (for non raw paleo dietary stuff) and the off topic section should be called "non dietary topics".
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You wrote: "..so the claim re raw beef and cancer is clearly wrong."
And I ask you: HOW do YOU know??
You don't have ANY proof that the connection is "clearly wrong".
Nevertheless, you are free to think and speculate what you want.
Löwenherz
I showed previously that many studies demonstrate that increasing cooking temperatures increases the rate of cancer, and so on, so that it is highly likely that I am correct.
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Citing critical articles is not necessarily "anti-rawpaleo".
BTW: Here is the forum description on the main page: "Hot Topics, Discussions of non-RAF/non- raw topics. Raw vegan and Fruitarian topics may be discussed here but only here., Moderator: djr_81"
Löwenherz
The intention is to discuss anti-rawpalaeo topics. That is why it is called the "Hot Topics" forum. "Hot" meaning that the topics are illegal or dangerous or too controversial to be placed in other forums. This topic is definitely too controversial.