Author Topic: Cravings  (Read 9234 times)

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Offline DeadRamones

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Cravings
« on: October 08, 2009, 03:09:20 am »
Since switching to raw meat. I've been getting this demonic craving for chocolates. It's very hard to fight it. Not just any chocolate, really dark & bitter 80% or higher. I tried to pin point my actions. I read that it might be a magnesium defficancy. So I've included some salt, raw salmon,tuna & cod on the weekends. It still hits me every now & then but not so bad.

Any tips on how to fight these craving?

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2009, 04:24:19 pm »
Either find large amounts of a raw food that gives you cravings(I for example can't get enough of raw scallops) or go in temporarily for high-quality chocolates(ie few or no preservatives//additives/no dairy) or make it a rule to eat such chocolates only after having eaten a full meal of raw meat/fat(and perhaps carbs), the idea being to limit consumption of the chocolate.
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Offline invisible

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2009, 06:57:22 pm »
Any tips on how to fight these craving?

willpower

Offline DeadRamones

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2009, 09:37:33 pm »
I know will power is key. But I'm very in tune with my body, I know there is something missing.
I've started eating more marrow now so hopefully that'll help if it is a mineral defficancy. Thanks Tyler, I'll try to maybe have a trivial amount of chocolate after eating. To help with the craving.

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2009, 09:47:30 pm »
But I'm very in tune with my body, I know there is something missing.
Carbohydrates?
Are you VLC/ZC? If so how long ago did you switch?
Chocolate has a fair amount of carbohydrates in it so you could just be going through typical carb cravings as you keto-adapt.
If this is the case I'm of the opinion that willpower is your best option here. Tyler suggestion will help ease cravings but could make adaptation take longer and might maintain the cravings at a higher level. Eat more fat to sate your cravings. :)

Offline SkinnyDevil

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2009, 01:24:18 am »
Several suppliers sell RAW chocolate. Some in bars (like raw vegan bars from Raw Revolution or Lara's) and some just the raw, shelled chocolate (cacao nibs).

I'd suggest the latter to see if it is really the chocolate that your body is craving or something your body associates with the chocolate you have eaten in the past (like the dairy or sugar). That way you don;t just satisfy a craving, you learn why you're craving it.
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Offline Raw Kyle

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2009, 04:34:27 am »
These are truly awesome

http://www.empoweredfoods.com/empowerd_chocolate_bar.html

I wouldn't call it healthy, but all the ingredients are raw and organic and relatively paleo.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2009, 10:44:29 am »
I was buying dark chocolate now and then while VLC and got increasing cravings for it. So I stopped buying it and eating it and the cravings disappeared. Instead, I try to make sure there's some raw, unprocessed, carnivorous food I really like available at all times.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2009, 04:49:22 pm »
Carbohydrates?
Are you VLC/ZC? If so how long ago did you switch?
Chocolate has a fair amount of carbohydrates in it so you could just be going through typical carb cravings as you keto-adapt.
If this is the case I'm of the opinion that willpower is your best option here. Tyler suggestion will help ease cravings but could make adaptation take longer and might maintain the cravings at a higher level. Eat more fat to sate your cravings. :)

I don't think he is necessarily zero-carb, I just mentioned the very vague possibility that he might be. As regards the raw chocolate suggestion, that's great, I'd forgotten about it but many Primal Dieters still eat raw chocolate(or raw cacao(?), I think, mainly)
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline DeadRamones

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2009, 01:57:51 am »
Thanks for the info & replys. Not a ZC & not so much a VLC depending on your standards. I get around 80-100gms/day from honey & fruits(bananas,apples,berries). That's only upon waking & after workouts. My diet isn't full paleo yet. I'm still transitioning.

I used to have to cut weight for grappling & mma. So I'm pretty used to controlling my appetite in order to diet/cut weight. That's why I'm guessing it's more of a mineral deficiency.

 I'm guessing back when I ate grains my mineral intake was somewhat balanced. I used to only buy the lease process stuff quinoa,whole wheats, sottish oats,brown rice. Back then grains made up around 40-60% of my diet. The only times I'll have any grain now is in social environments(parties,beer & pizza with friends & some dessert with my GF)

I bought a small bag of raw cocoa beans. I plan on just having 1 bean once or twice a day tops & only after eating.  I'll mark my results in this post after a few weeks.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2009, 02:04:39 am by DeadRamones »

Offline SkinnyDevil

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2009, 02:58:13 am »
Good plan.
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2009, 07:00:13 am »
Back then grains made up around 40-60% of my diet.
Despite containing magnesium, wheat, including whole wheat, can actually deplete magnesium in humans and is one of the main culprits in the epidemic of magnesium deficiency in the US. Undigested grain phytates interfere with the utilization of folic acid, riboflavin, iron, zinc, calcium, magnesium, copper, manganese and proteins, resulting in severe nutrient deficiencies in humans who eat too much unfortified grains (before grain fortification, nutrient deficiency diseases and disorders were widespread even among Western nations). The phytates and other proteins in the grains also have stuctures similar to pathogenic viruses and bacteria, which can trigger autoimmune disorders in humans, resulting in damage to organs and other ill effects. Even fortified grains can contribute to nutrient-depletion, malabsorption and autoimmune disorders, particularly in people with high levels of genetic susceptibility, high intake of grains, or long-term intake of grains. One common effect is damage to the epithelial layer in the small intestine, which reduces its ability to absorb nutrients and increases its permeability to toxins such as the very same phytate antinutrients, as well as gluten proteins, opioids and other damaging molecules.

Some sources:

"...the bioavailability of zinc, copper and magnesium in cereal grains is generally low [75], whereas the absorption of manganese, chromium and selenium does not appear to be impaired [90]. Except for zinc, the clinical implications of deficiencies in these minerals relative to cereal grain consumption have been poorly studied. Consequently, few links have been established between high cereal grain consumption and deficiencies of copper, magnesium, manganese, chromium and selenium in human diets. However, there is substantial evidence which demonstrates that relatively high consumption of cereal grains can have a detrimental influence upon zinc metabolism and thus adversely affect human health and well-being." (Cereal Grains: Humanity's Double-Edged Sword, Loren Cordain, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10489816)

"The well-documented phytates of cereal grains sequester many divalent ions including calcium, zinc, iron, and magnesium, which can impair bone growth and metabolism. Further, there are antinutrients in cereal grains which directly impair vitamin D metabolism [Batchelor 1983; Clement 1987]; and rickets are routinely induced in animal models via consumption of high levels of cereal grains [Sly 1984]." (The Late Role of Grains and Legumes in the Human Diet, and Biochemical Evidence of their Evolutionary Discordance, by Loren Cordain, Ph.D., 1999, www.beyondveg.com/cat/paleodiet/index.shtml)

See also PHYTASES, ACIDES NUCLÉIQUES LES CODANT ET LEURS PROCÉDÉS DE PRODUCTION ET D'UTILISATION, http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/fr/ia.jsp?ia=US2007%2F079187&IA=US2007%2F079187&DISPLAY=DESC
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline DeadRamones

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2009, 01:26:16 pm »
Thanks Phil. This site is full with to much info. Sometimes I feel like printing everything & putting it in a binder.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: Cravings
« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2009, 07:26:05 pm »
 ;D Yeah, a mountain of evidence has accumulated in support of Paleolithic nutrition and evolutionary medicine and it continues to grow. To spare the trees, I save the nicer bits to my hard drive, which I can then do a search on when I need to find it again.

Magnesium levels in raw meats are lower than some other nutrients, like zinc, so if one has a pre-existing magnesium deficiency from years of eating wheat and other grains, perhaps the meat might not be enough to offset that deficiency in the short term and some amount of supplementation might make sense. In my own case I noticed that my zinc deficiency symptoms cleared up rapidly on a mostly-raw carnivorous diet, whereas my potassium deficiency symptoms took a little while longer to resolve, though they were also rapid, and my magnesium deficiency symptoms improved but have not yet resolved. Interestingly, my results match the ranking of these nutrients in raw grass-fed ground beef (http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/beef-products/10526/2):

Zinc 1.3 mg 8%

Potassium 80.9 mg 2%

Magnesium 5.3 mg 1%

The surprising thing is that all these levels are low, yet my symptoms resolved more quickly eating this stuff than eating plants that contain much higher levels of these nutrients (such as potassium-rich bananas). So I think that for me the antinutrient effects of plants and low bioavailability of plant nutrients offset the high nutrient levels. Others may have a different experience.
« Last Edit: October 10, 2009, 07:58:14 pm by PaleoPhil »
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

 

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