I was too until I noticed that Charles silenced or banned anyone who reported bad results from ZC. LOL The ZIOH forum is a lot like the 30bananasaday forum in the way that coctivore ZCers do.
...
Yes, Charles did talk about vitamin C and scurvy quite a bit and I questioned Charles face-to-face on it years ago and he didn't have a good answer. Wish I could remember the exact question. I do remember that he wasn't as knowledgeable about it as he pretended, but his devoted followers ate up what he said anyway. I didn't pursue it further to avoid stirring up a hornets nest of anger at a friendly gathering.
That doesn't surprise me in the least.
I'm ZC most days of a year, and among the other days I'll probably be VVLC 80% of them. That tells you a lot.
But I totally agree about the similitudes between ZIOH and 30Bananas, in those regards.
Many ZIOH members are delusional, first and foremost their leader.
For sure, the fact that you cannot gain weight, or that you'll lose weight on the long term, just by eating only animal foods, is easy to refute.
Type of meat, cooking, salting, flavoring, and such, have a lot more to do with it.
In spite of being ZC/VLC, on the subject of weight loss, I lean more towards the importance of "reward" of foods vs. "insulin" effect.
Everyone can try eating bacon, ribs, cream, butter, and so on, "at libitum", for 6 months in a row, and most people will eventually get fat.
Simply, meats, on average, are less rewarding than many carbohydrate rich foods, plus eliminating variety, as one does being ZC, helps in that sense too.
Of course if you were obese you'll generally drop weight.
ZC foods take you to a lower "set point", than including foods like pizza, icecream, sodas, nice pastas, fries, and so on.
But thinking that eating bacon vs. raw suet, or even grilled ribs vs. raw ground beef, would make no difference, weight wise, in my opinion is almost laughable.
Same thing for the stance that the reason nuts and dairy might cause weight gain is because of their small carb content.
INSULIN INSULIN INSULIN INSULINAnd there's no way that they'll let you point it out things like that.
Even if you actually eat ZC.
I know plenty of ZC's aren't, after a long time by now, even close to the weight they'd like to be at.
Nonetheless, no one should dare question ZIOH efficacy.
I pointed out the weight (loss) aspect, because, again, it's a pretty easy one to refute.
from today's entry:
facebook.com/groups/zioh2/permalink/940930345949198/
...
You eat meat and drink water in crazy quantities. You don't gain. No obese person ever gained significant weight on ZC. They didn't lose what they wanted sometimes but they did NOT gain. You can eat as much meat as you wish to yet you don't gain!
...
Yeah, sure... try that with bacon and let me know how it goes.