Author Topic: cavities  (Read 10087 times)

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Offline Tim

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cavities
« on: May 28, 2009, 08:44:46 am »
ive been experiencing some tooth discomfort the past week, if this is a cavity, does anyone have any suggestions on the most holistic approach to fixing this?

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: cavities
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2009, 09:01:35 am »
ive been experiencing some tooth discomfort the past week, if this is a cavity, does anyone have any suggestions on the most holistic approach to fixing this?
I read that cavities partially heal naturally when you're on a healthy, low-carb, Paleo-type diet. I moved my diet in the direction of Lex Rooker's when prescription fluoride alone didn't completely heal and desensitize a hole in my tooth (which developed while on a SAD) that exposed a root (though it did help quite a bit--sorry anti-fluoride people). Now on a VLC mostly raw diet with raw and lightly cooked meats my root has no pain and was only slightly sensitive to a dental cleaning.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2009, 11:05:52 am by PaleoPhil »
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: cavities
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2009, 10:12:09 am »
clove oil will stop pain and slow down the cavity.
In the book www.curetoothdecay.com it is a mostly primal diet approach, lots of nutritious raw animal food.
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: cavities
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2009, 08:44:39 am »
More evidence that even wild fruits cause dental problems in animals. Doesn't look like we should be emulating heavy-fruit-eating chimps. A zero carb Paleo diet can actually remineralize cavities.

Tooth Decay in Chimps
From Wild Health By Cindy Engel:

"Kenneth Glander, director of primate research at Duke Primate Center, studied the teeth of more than 950 mantled howler monkeys in South America and found a complete absence of cavities and gum disease. These monkeys not only have a low-sugar diet, they also eat a great quantity of cashew pedicels (Anacardium occidentale)-which contain the phenolic compounds anacardic acid and cardol that are active against tooth-decay bacteria. This diet of low sugar and high phenols may be helping to protect the monkeys against tooth decay. Phenols such as tannins are common in many plants, and are known to inhibit the growth of Streptococcus mutans, a main protagonist in tooth decay.

Chimpanzees, which eat far more sugary fruit than howler monkeys, suffer from both tooth decay and gum disease. To cope with this ailment, they chew on antibacterial barks-which local people use to keep teeth healthy-and inspect and clean each other's teeth. In captivity, one chimpanzee was even seen to pry out the bad teeth of another by means of a simple wooden lever she had made."
« Last Edit: July 28, 2009, 10:39:52 am by PaleoPhil »
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: cavities
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2009, 10:10:56 am »
I recommend eating bone meal and dolomite.  Swishing one or the other of those in your mouth (immediately after each meal) has really helped my teeth. 

Offline SuperInfinity

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Re: cavities
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2009, 03:18:19 am »
clove oil will stop pain and slow down the cavity.
In the book www.curetoothdecay.com it is a mostly primal diet approach, lots of nutritious raw animal food.

What are you on about???????????

Almost never in the history of evolution did man eat "lots of nutritious raw animal food".

Only when times get extremely bad. ie. a non-optimal food source. I don't know where this bastardized idea that primal man ate "lot of nutritious raw animal food". Raw animal food is anything but nutritious!

Apes often throw away good monkey meat they just caught if there's good fruit around.  ;)

Offline SuperInfinity

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Re: cavities
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2009, 03:21:33 am »
From that site:

"•Avoiding radiation exposure from x-rays - $priceless"

What a clown. You'd have to be some fool to fall for the likes of a site like that.

Throwing up the image of Dr. Price, a dead man, as if he somehow condoned whatever nonsense thing they're trying to sell is really really low.

I really wish the mods around here would stamp out the trolling of many of the above people who are going around spewing ignorance about what primal man ate and clear spam. This forum is a joke.

Offline invisible

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Re: cavities
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2009, 07:51:22 am »
This forum is a joke.

Then fuck off?

k thx

Offline phatdave

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Re: cavities
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2009, 08:17:48 am »
Then fuck off?

k thx

This guy superinvisable is.......well not very nice. I would ban someone as rude, unconstructive, and aggressive as this.

Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: cavities
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2009, 09:22:02 am »
clove oil will stop pain and slow down the cavity.
In the book www.curetoothdecay.com it is a mostly primal diet approach, lots of nutritious raw animal food.
Right you are goodsamaritan. You are so helpful and constructive, as usual. Given your fruitarian past, you understand from experience the value of raw animal foods and the hazards of overindulging in sweet and acidic fruits, yes? I am simply amazed at the benefits to my dental health from a carnivorous diet.

Many vegetarians are finally admitting that chimps, and indeed all primates, eat some nonplant foods, but they argue that meats form a small part of their overall diet. This ignores the inconvenient facts that Colobus monkeys are the FAVORITE food of the chimpanzees who hunt them. The rarity of animal meat and fat in their diet makes it MORE enjoyable, not less--a treasured treat that generates an orgy of excitement among both male and female chimps in the following video:

Chimps hunting a monkey
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WDFh5JdYh7I

As the narrator explains, group hunting and sharing of the spoils likely played a large role in what made us human. In other words, without hunting, there would be no fruitarian humans; indeed, no human race as we know it.

Female chimps love animal foods so much that they will give sexual favors in return for some of the spoils of the hunt. As I recall, scientists have been learning that animal foods help female primates go into estrus, become sexually stimulated, get pregnant, and have healthy offspring. Indeed, if it weren't for animal meat and fat, chimps would likely go extinct--the nightmare result of a purely fruitarian regime.

It's quite a marvel to see the ingenious hunting tactics that chimps use in acquiring their favorite prey:

Chimpanzees team up to attack a monkey in the wild - BBC wildlife
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1WBs74W4ik&feature=fvw

Given all the evidence that in recent years has been pouring in, it requires a willing suspension of disbelief to cling to vegetarian dogma.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline SuperInfinity

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Re: cavities
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2009, 10:38:00 am »
Right you are goodsamaritan. You are so helpful and constructive, as usual. Given your fruitarian past, you understand from experience the value of raw animal foods and the hazards of overindulging in sweet and acidic fruits, yes? I am simply amazed at the benefits to my dental health from a carnivorous diet.

goodsamaritan is nothing more than a lapsed fruitarian and an apologist of the fruitarian and high-fruit way, ie. the paleo diet. He is like a FINO.... Fruitarian In Name Only.
 
Many vegetarians are finally admitting that chimps, and indeed all primates, eat some nonplant foods, but they argue that meats form a small part of their overall diet. This ignores the inconvenient facts that Colobus monkeys are the FAVORITE food of the chimpanzees who hunt them. The rarity of animal meat and fat in their diet makes it MORE enjoyable, not less--a treasured treat that generates an orgy of excitement among both male and female chimps in the following video:

Yes, so can you imagine the surprise of the primatologist who saw them throwing away the high protein monkey meat. Monkey meat that was: 1) Fresher than you have EVER eaten, 2) Raw, 3) Organic, 4) Had a natural diet and not farmed in any way? This would have brought up the percentage of their diet from that day what, maybe 10%? But they threw it away.

The excitement is there, but chimps get excited like that a lot. Have you ever watched Monkey Business or a programmes like that? Those chimps are screaming so much at the slightest thing I have to turn it off!!!

Female chimps love animal foods so much that they will give sexual favors in return for some of the spoils of the hunt.

Bonobo females are notorious for doing this all the time for (a word you use in the US a lot) "regular" food. They gather them lots of food (often bipedally, as bonobos are known to do quite a lot) and for that the female bonobos perform for them.

Another twist to it is that females try to choose the biggest and best males to mate with and are looking out for these types of guys. They can do this by displaying, such as with threatening confrontations which another might cower from, if they're carnivorous primates showing their thick canines (much bigger than humans) which disintegrate with age as is unfortunately normal for primate teeth or even "wahoo" contests in baboons where their health and status is shown by their voice. The high rank of course shows that their offspring will have good genes and also so the big male can defend the females' offspring (the males don't always know if it's theirs, but they'll defend them for continuing sexual favours). What better way to show a very high rank than coming back from a hunt first in the pack with a big fresh piece of monkey meat in hand? The display isn't necessarily practical, as argued by another primatologist.. Craig Stanford maybe?
 
As I recall, scientists have been learning that animal foods help female primates go into estrus, become sexually stimulated, get pregnant, and have healthy offspring. Indeed, if it weren't for animal meat and fat, chimps would likely go extinct--the nightmare result of a purely fruitarian regime.

No you're wrong, thousands (millions?) of vegans get pregnant every year with few or no problems. They may take supplements... if needs be they could eat fish, eggs, all types of animal protein... animal meat specifically? Yeah right!!!!

Offline goodsamaritan

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Re: cavities
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2009, 03:55:45 pm »
goodsamaritan is nothing more than a lapsed fruitarian and an apologist of the fruitarian and high-fruit way, ie. the paleo diet. He is like a FINO.... Fruitarian In Name Only.

Tsk tsk.  SuperInfinity, I think you need to calm down and and think of your style of posting.  I know you are very excited with whatever knowledge you have right now.  But your closed minded attitude shuts down all learning with mere gorilla proud chest thumping.

Lapsed fruitarian? 

- I gave up on 2 months of fruitarian diet because it did not work on me.  I was malnourished.  I was cold.  And I live in a tropical country with around 27 to 33 degrees celsius.

Apologist of the fruitarian high fruit way? 

- apologist?  Nope.  As a moderator and Network Administrator and Web Host of this forum I'd like people to be tolerant of the wide scope of what Raw Paleo Diet is.  Some people thrive on less meat, some people thrive on more meat.

Fruitarian in name only?

- Duh.  My breakfast is usually a high nutrition fruit like organic papaya or organic guava plus a fat like coconut juice + meat or avocados or raw duck eggs.

- Lunch is raw animal food.

- Dinner is raw animal food.

I have experience with cavities with my own kids.  Something you seem not to have with your current impatience.

I'm trying to follow the cure tooth decay guidelines in the book for my childrens' sake.  Just have misgivings about dairy because no dairy worked for me yet.


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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: cavities
« Reply #12 on: July 30, 2009, 06:39:53 am »
...I'm trying to follow the cure tooth decay guidelines in the book for my childrens' sake.  Just have misgivings about dairy because no dairy worked for me yet.
My non-dairy carnivorous diet has done wonders so far for my tooth decay. I found that, for me, even surprisingly small amounts of fruit or nuts counteracted the dental benefits of the meat and fat. I'm hoping that I'll be able to eat some fruits like small amounts of small berries in the future, but for now I'm letting the healing take its course.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline Michael

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Re: cavities
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2009, 05:59:15 am »
Amazing videos PaleoPhil!!  Thanks for those links.

It's been some time since I've been on this forum as I had a new son born 12 weeks ago.  Who is this Superinfinity character?!  What a moron!!

Like paleophil, my cavities and lifelong tooth problems are non-existent on my VLC paleodiet.  I've been eating raw paleo (initially AV's primal diet for couple of years or so) since 2001.
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: cavities
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2009, 07:00:39 am »
Amazing videos PaleoPhil!!  Thanks for those links.

It's been some time since I've been on this forum as I had a new son born 12 weeks ago.  Who is this Superinfinity character?!  What a moron!!

Like paleophil, my cavities and lifelong tooth problems are non-existent on my VLC paleodiet.  I've been eating raw paleo (initially AV's primal diet for couple of years or so) since 2001.
You're welcome for the videos. For someone to watch those and still think that all primates are naturally pure vegetarians would require an extreme level of self-delusion. I come from a background of initially wanting to embrace vegetarianism and trying it more than once, but learning better with experience, research and asking lots of questions instead of accepting the dogma of prominent vegetarians and "experts." I've learned to question all assumptions.

I try not to get personal, though Superinfinity certainly tested me on that. He follows what seems to be a completely unique fruit-heavy diet based mostly or solely on his own tastes. He seemed to be expanding it a bit recently, as his dental visit drew nearer and his poor dental health became an increasing concern. If I got anything wrong, he's free to correct me.

I've found that raw meat--especially jerky--actually cleans my teeth, whereas surprisingly small amounts of fruit and nuts crud them up. Your mileage may vary. This would explain why wolves and wild dogs don't need tooth brushes or special dental chews, whereas pet dogs tend to need them. After all, the titular wolf wasn't called "White Fang" for nothing. ;D It would also explain why wild chimp populations that eat lots of fruit tend to have significant rates of caries despite using tree barks containing anti-bacterial oils to clean their teeth (I supported this with research references in earlier posts).

Thanks for sharing your personal experience that matches the reports of many.
>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: cavities
« Reply #15 on: August 19, 2009, 05:02:17 pm »
Amazing videos PaleoPhil!!  Thanks for those links.

It's been some time since I've been on this forum as I had a new son born 12 weeks ago.  Who is this Superinfinity character?!  What a moron!!

Like paleophil, my cavities and lifelong tooth problems are non-existent on my VLC paleodiet.  I've been eating raw paleo (initially AV's primal diet for couple of years or so) since 2001.

Superinfinity was just a troll. He claimed to follow a raw fruitarian diet, then made all sorts of posts about the so-called advantages of cooking.Anyway, we banned him after he made yet another insult to a fellow member.
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