Author Topic: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?  (Read 16142 times)

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Offline RawZi

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #25 on: January 09, 2010, 01:35:55 am »
...  One does not need to be the epitome of health to reproduce.  One need only survive and have lots of sex.

    One short sex act is enough to do that in some cases.  Of course lots of sex may keep the parents happier and so then maybe the progeny (maybe twins etc) healthier or who knows.  I'm sure it must be only fiction, but I watched an episode of House recently where it turned out a woman accidentally spontaneously conceived not even having had sex once, by her account, and proven upon genetic analysis of the fetal related material.
"Genuine truth angers people in general because they don't know what to do with the energy generated by a glimpse of reality." Greg W. Goodwin

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #26 on: February 10, 2010, 08:03:48 pm »
Not fallacious at all, at least from the facts you offer.  Wikepedia cites a date of around 100,000 years ago as when Homo sapiens began migrating from Africa.  The only date I was able to find for when Homo neanderthalensis began cooking was about 50,000 years ago, which may well have been long after H. sapiens began living with him in Europe.  It seems reasonable to me that H. neanderthalensis most likely learned to cook from H. sapiens.  As for why H. neanderthalensis went extinct despite cooking, perhaps by the time he learned to do it he was already on the decline in Europe and wasn't able to become competitive against H. sapiens, even though both species now had more calories available.

Where do you get 105,000 years as the earliest point at which humans began cooking?  I remember a far broader range from the "Origins of cooking" paper.  Anyway, that's still early enough that it began in Africa, and then could migrate over the world with the spread of H. sapiens.
 The 105,000 years ago date I gave was specifically for non-palaeo foods(ie grains - there was a recent study I showed on rawpaleoforum which claimed palaeo man ate a few grains as far as 105,000 years ago).

As for cooking PALAEO foods, that happened c.250,000 years ago and evidence thereof exist throughout the world, so it is extremely unlikely that the Neanderthals ever learnt cooking from homo sapiens. I'm afraid there is this outdated notion that the Neanderthals were simple, grunting brutes by comparison to humans, yet actually there is plenty of evidence to show that they were highly intelligent, able to talk and had an interesting culture.

In short, the explanation re cooked foods being addictive re opioids seems far more compelling.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2010, 09:19:46 pm by TylerDurden »
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William

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #27 on: February 10, 2010, 08:58:54 pm »
I'm sure it must be only fiction, but I watched an episode of House recently where it turned out a woman accidentally spontaneously conceived


Conceived what?


Quote
not even having had sex once


Define "sex". Note that the media is very careful not to do so.   :D

Quote
by her account, and proven upon genetic analysis of the fetal related material.

Hm. Fetal related material, eh? Sounds like deliberately fuzzy/vague language.

William

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #28 on: February 10, 2010, 09:04:30 pm »
  The 105,000 years ago date I gave was specifically for non-palaeo foods(ie grains - there was a recent study I showed on rawpaleoforum which claimed palaeo man ate a few grains as far as 105,000 years ago).


A study which allegedly shows that paleoman was as suicidally stupid as neolithic man does not fool many here.

Offline jessica

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #29 on: February 10, 2010, 09:50:38 pm »
In short, the explanation re cooked foods being addictive re opioids seems far more compelling.

how does cooking produce opioids?  romaine and many heritage varieties of lettuce contain opioids i can attest that when eaten at a large enough amount they do become addictive

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #30 on: February 10, 2010, 09:59:31 pm »
how does cooking produce opioids?  romaine and many heritage varieties of lettuce contain opioids i can attest that when eaten at a large enough amount they do become addictive
Do they contain opioids in raw form? Well, lettuce is hardly a palaeo food, so we can put it aside along with the opioid-heavy raw dairy.  For info on opioids in cooking see here:-

http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/cooking.htm

http://banzhaf.net/docs/newsci.html
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline jessica

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #31 on: February 10, 2010, 10:38:36 pm »
Do they contain opioids in raw form? Well, lettuce is hardly a palaeo food, so we can put it aside along with the opioid-heavy raw dairy.  For info on opioids in cooking see here:-

http://www.youngerthanyourage.com/13/cooking.htm

http://banzhaf.net/docs/newsci.html

 it is in the raw form and in  different levels in the white milk sap the is evident when you pick a leaf from the stem of leaf type lettuces, wild or domesticated. this can be "cooked" down a more potent  substance from wild lettuce. i do not think opioids are necessarily evil or unpaleo, paleo man perhaps smoked of the wild lettuce to promote connectedness with the spirit...! isnt there a quote the gods want you to be happy that is why they created beer? same thing for any substance (high meat..etc..) that brings such a level of chemical joy/wellbeing to the human body and more so the plant derived substances of the past before they were adulterated and made super potent and detrimental by our "new technologies"

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2010, 10:43:01 pm »
"High-meat" isn't addictive in the way opioids are. All high-meat does is stimulate the brain to release more serotonin in reaction to the excess bacteria. There's no chemical altering of the brain etc. as what happens with cooked/processed foods.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
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Offline jessica

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2010, 10:55:47 pm »
All high-meat does is stimulate the brain to release more serotonin in reaction to the excess bacteria. There's no chemical altering of the brain etc

stimulating production of serotonin in the brain is not addictive or even a chemical alteration?
well it probably should be, do you think our bodies and minds are not wise enough to distinguish between things that are beneficial and the craving for such a substances(serotonin producing high meat persay) and things that are a panacea and really foul up our systems such as cooked meat, wheat, heroin?  we are just so disconnected from the signals that we actually do not recognize good from bad...maybe this ability to override is a new pattern for our species...................?
also sorry for the digression, i am not pro or anti opioid, lettuce or addiction!

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: Evolutionary benefits of cooking?
« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2010, 11:42:03 pm »
stimulating production of serotonin in the brain is not addictive or even a chemical alteration?
well it probably should be, do you think our bodies and minds are not wise enough to distinguish between things that are beneficial and the craving for such a substances(serotonin producing high meat persay) and things that are a panacea and really foul up our systems such as cooked meat, wheat, heroin?  we are just so disconnected from the signals that we actually do not recognize good from bad...maybe this ability to override is a new pattern for our species...................?
also sorry for the digression, i am not pro or anti opioid, lettuce or addiction!
Well, I can tell the difference between high-meat and alcohol/raw dairy etc., for example. The high-meat gives me no side-effects and I don't get addictive cravings for high-meat, either, unlike with raw dairy etc.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

 

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