How Dangerous are Cooked Paleo Diets?

[goodsamaritan]

Need your opinions here.

It's hard for me to convince people to go raw paleo.

But it is easier for people to go cooked paleo.

And the cooked paleo diet community is indeed growing.

How Dangerous are Cooked Paleo Diets?

- cooked fat, cooked protein, cooked starches.

We always say raw fat will cleanse, lubricate, nourish etc.

But can we say the same thing with cooked fat?

ETc.

[Brad462]

I only know that I don't do very good if I eat very much cooked meat.  I think cooked paleo is totally fine if you don't eat that much meat.

[TylerDurden]

Ultimately, our best chance is with people who've done all the various diets, ultimately leading to raw vegan/fruitarian or cooked-palaeolithic-diet, and yet still failing. They've got nothing to lose and will try rawpalaeo despite all the anti-raw hysteria.

As regards cooked-palaeo, many of those do follow our advice a little bit. I notice that on  a particular cooked-palaeo diet group, some of them have started cooking at lower temperatures in moisture and other techniques. Plus, there is a ton of scientific studies from pubmed etc. on the serious dangers of heat-created toxins derived from cooking, which can convince the more rationally-minded.

[eveheart]

Cooked foods, even from the paleolithic food lists, bring back all my stiff and achy symptoms quickly, so I infer that they are bad for me.

I am not quite sure why you would want to convince people to go raw paleo. Usually, a person who is a crusader is considered a pain-in-the-neck by people within earshot. A good leader doesn't have to drag people to follow him. I know you are motivated to heal people, but if healing is your gift, let it come naturally.

You may have heard the saying, "When the student is ready, the teacher will appear." I think the inverse is true: "When the teacher is ready, the student will appear."

[goodsamaritan]

I have a loved one in his senior years and he's fat and starting to have blood sugar problems.  They are on cooked omnivore without junk food but they have wheat and corn and veggies and rice.

He is of the generation who has a phobia with red meat fat... The animal fat will kill you cholesterol bullshit.

I'd like him to go raw paleo, but that's a stretch.  But he can do cooked paleo, with red meat cooked fats.... But he is deathly afraid phobia afflicted of red meat fat.

[Iguana]

I am not quite sure why you would want to convince people to go raw paleo. Usually, a person who is a crusader is considered a pain-in-the-neck by people within earshot. A good leader doesn't have to drag people to follow him. I know you are motivated to heal people, but if healing is your gift, let it come naturally.

You may have heard the saying, "When the student is ready, the teacher will appear." I think the inverse is true: "When the teacher is ready, the student will appear."

Very true!

[Ioanna]

But he can do cooked paleo, with red meat cooked fats.... But he is deathly afraid phobia afflicted of red meat fat.

would he eat the red meat cooked very rare?, then i think it could be ok

[cherimoya_kid]

I have a loved one in his senior years and he's fat and starting to have blood sugar problems.  They are on cooked omnivore without junk food but they have wheat and corn and veggies and rice.

He is of the generation who has a phobia with red meat fat... The animal fat will kill you cholesterol bullshit.

I'd like him to go raw paleo, but that's a stretch.  But he can do cooked paleo, with red meat cooked fats.... But he is deathly afraid phobia afflicted of red meat fat.

Then put him on raw fish.  Maybe you can work him up to meat after he starts to enjoy the raw fish.

[raw]

Cooked red meat usually make me sick if I continue consume that for couple of days without a raw meat brake. Cooking in gas is one thing, but if u must need to cook, then why don't u convience ur friend to cook on natural wood burning stove then gas or eletricity? I definitely would like to be a cooked vegan person then a cooked paleo.

[Joy2012]

Gently cooked greens is quite healthy IMO.  Too much cooked fatty grain-fed pork made me feel very bad.

[Iguana]

http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/instinctoanopsology/who-has-read-gc-burger%27s-first-book/msg98397/#msg98397

Very significant facts can be learned from these experimentations, including:
- Heat damaged molecules and use of milk are very harmful;
- It can cause diseases such as rheumatism or disorders of the nervous system that modern medicine does not think assigning to food;
- "Soft" thermal damages are even more toxic!
Guy Claude proposed as explanatory hypothesis that  slightly damaged molecules have a part of their structure recognized as correct by our immune system and are thus admitted in the biochemical metabolic processes. But as these molecules are not exactly consistent, they induce later deep troubles in the metabolism.

And:

The hypothesis is that a completely destroyed molecule will be recognized as such, be discarded by the immune system and then eliminated, while a slightly damaged one may not be and is therefore potentially more likely to induce metabolic troubles. 

I don’t think there’s a clear limit; the precautionary principle commands to avoid any food having been heated over 40°C. Of course, not all the molecules in a heated or cooked foodstuff are damaged or wrecked, perhaps only one out of 100 or 1000 and that’s why we can live on cooked food. But during a lifetime, we’ll have ingested about 75 tons of food. If only one molecule out of 1000 in this food is wrecked or damaged, it still makes for 75 kg of countless kinds of abnormal substances, each being able to cause serious and delayed health troubles.

Organic molecules are extremely complex and comprise hundreds or even thousands of atoms, each being in an exact and specific spatial position! There’s a remarkable order and an amazing precision in the mechanisms of life (increasing negative entropy  ). As a rule, life can work only in a very limited range of temperature (0 to 40° C), because an excessive thermal agitation destroy this accurate order, increasing entropy  , creating disorder. Simply put, heat burns the living things!

As GCB wrote somewhere in that book, the safest way of cooking would be to thoroughly carbonize everything! 
 
Cheers
Francois

[Joy2012]

I read somewhere that,  if  50+% of a meal is raw food (by calories I assume), then the body's immune system (white blood cells) will not react.

Just for damage control. I am not advocating cooking food.


I also read this somewhere:  The author's 80-year-old father was diagnosed with cancer. The father refused to go through the painful treatment suggested by the doctor. Instead, he went back to his old home in the countryside and pulled the vegetables growing in his backyard and boiled them as his main diet. He passed away peacefully at 94.

I think health is a combination of many things. Raw diet is very  important. But it is not the only thing.

[Iguana]

I think health is a combination of many things. Raw diet is very  important. But it is not the only thing.

Absolutely.

That belief (which I had unfortunately shared for a few decades) about the avoidance of  "digestive leukocytosis" by eating partly raw only seems to come from the questionable work of Kouchakoff at Lausanne in 1920-37. GC Burger, who is by a funny coincidence also from Lausanne (as I am too !) tried to replicate such results without success.

http://www.beyondveg.com/tu-j-l/raw-cooked/raw-cooked-1i.shtml
Leukocytosis was avoided if at least 10% raw foods were also eaten.

That is, Kouchakoff found (if his results are to be believed) that when a cooked food is ingested, leukocytosis can be avoided simply by adding about 10% of the same raw food [Kouchakoff 1937, p. 336], or a raw food whose "critical temperature" is higher [Kouchakoff 1937, pp. 332-334]. (Note: "critical temperature" here refers to the specific temperature for a specific food above which leukocytosis occurs.) Therefore, by these results, it is by no means necessary to eat 100% raw or even predominantly raw to avoid leukocytosis; even totally cooked meals would be fine provided cooking temperatures are low enough.

Note that Beyondveg has a strong anti-raw bias, which has been well debunked by our Tyler here: http://www.rawpaleodiet.com/articles/anti-raw-bias-on-beyondveg-com-website-debunked/. But the above page is nevertheless interesting.

[ochena_bikel]

Cooked paleo diet doesn't suit on my body. This is why, I just avoid cooked paleo diets.
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