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Offline invisible

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vitamin C in dried meat
« on: December 12, 2009, 04:38:51 pm »
I ordered some of Dr Ron's freeze dried adrenal glands one of the reasons being for the vitamin C in adrenal glands. The packages say it is equivalent to entirely raw food, but I am wondering about water soluble vitamins like vitamin C and the effect that removing water from the food would have on them. Ideas?
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Offline invisible

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2009, 04:42:25 pm »
Dr Ron also sells 'buffered vitamin C'. What is that exactly? What's the source?
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2009, 05:25:08 pm »
I suspect that any vitamin C left, if any, in those dried adrenals will be more or less non-bioavailable.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2009, 06:18:28 pm »
do you think the buffered vitamin C is ok?
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Offline TylerDurden

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2009, 07:20:03 pm »
Quote from: invisible on December 12, 2009, 06:18:28 pm
do you think the buffered vitamin C is ok?
Anything that Dr Ron provides is usually of  the highest quality but it's still a supplement and shouldn't be relied on too much, anyway. In this case,though, the description sounds as though the product is highly processed.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2009, 07:26:36 pm »
I think I might have to try it. I want to try getting more vitamin C and I can't get fresh adrenals and prefer to not eat fruit.
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Offline van

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2009, 01:37:06 am »
one, maybe two limes a day works for me without adding too much sugar to my diet.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2009, 03:48:21 am »
    Are you showing signs of Vitamin C deficiency?

Quote from: invisible on December 12, 2009, 07:26:36 pm
I think I might have to try it. I want to try getting more vitamin C and I can't get fresh adrenals and prefer to not eat fruit.

    You Limy you Van!

Quote from: van on December 13, 2009, 01:37:06 am
one, maybe two limes a day works for me without adding too much sugar to my diet.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2009, 05:34:35 am »
I think Dr Ron's buffered vitamin c it is not actually very processed, just it has ALA added with it hence buffered.

I don't really have any signs of vitamin c deficiency, but I practically get none. I don't have access to fresh raw grass fed organs (or frequent access) and since vitamin c is found in them, I would like to get some.

I won't eat limes or lemons. They rot teeth.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #9 on: December 13, 2009, 06:45:12 am »
A lot of ZCers don't eat raw organs and don't complain of vitamin C deficiencies. However, I do eat small amounts of raw organs and shellfish (in which the organs are consumed with everything else), so I can't address it from experience. Shellfish would be another option for you too.
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Offline van

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2009, 07:30:49 am »
I tend to think the extra vit c from the limes helps with gums, but who knows?   As far as rotting teeth,  I swallow the small amount directly, and rinse immediately.  Small chance.  Basically it's more of an insurance method.  Vit c deteriorates quickly, I imagine even in meats.  Since I don't kill and eat right away, I figure it can't hurt.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2009, 07:45:47 am »
Quote from: PaleoPhil on December 13, 2009, 06:45:12 am
A lot of ZCers don't eat raw organs and don't complain of vitamin C deficiencies. However, I do eat small amounts of raw organs and shellfish (in which the organs are consumed with everything else), so I can't address it from experience. Shellfish would be another option for you too.

I don't think I have deficiencies but getting some more might help, I know it is said to help damaged skin which I have. Shellfish are an option but not a consistent reliable source I can have each day I think.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2009, 07:47:57 am »
Quote from: van on December 13, 2009, 07:30:49 am
I tend to think the extra vit c from the limes helps with gums, but who knows?   As far as rotting teeth,  I swallow the small amount directly, and rinse immediately.  Small chance.  Basically it's more of an insurance method.  Vit c deteriorates quickly, I imagine even in meats.  Since I don't kill and eat right away, I figure it can't hurt.

I don't think the vitamin C is the problem. The citric acid is. If it doesn't come into contact with your teeth, it comes into contact with your esophagus and intestines, and if it rots teeth, what will it do to them? Probably not much of a problem but still..

If you are eating a fruit for vitamin C I would eat one kiwifruit a day. Has more vitamin C than lemons I think and no citric acid.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2009, 07:57:45 am »
Quote from: invisible on December 13, 2009, 07:47:57 am
If you are eating a fruit for vitamin C I would eat one kiwifruit a day. Has more vitamin C than lemons I think and no citric acid.
The trade-off is it adds a lot more sugar than a lime. Pick your poison and how it sits in you.
I've got to admit though; I'd enjoy eating a daily kiwifruit much more than sucking on a lime for the C.
I wouldn't do it though when living in the US; the distance to ship the thing is way beyond a conscionable range IMO. I'd grow and eat some blueberries most of the year. :)
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Offline invisible

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2009, 08:12:48 am »
Quote from: djr_81 on December 13, 2009, 07:57:45 am
The trade-off is it adds a lot more sugar than a lime. Pick your poison and how it sits in you.
I've got to admit though; I'd enjoy eating a daily kiwifruit much more than sucking on a lime for the C.
I wouldn't do it though when living in the US; the distance to ship the thing is way beyond a conscionable range IMO. I'd grow and eat some blueberries most of the year. :)

according to nurtiondata.com 30 calories of lime has 29.1g vitamin c, while 30 calories of kiwifruit has 36.9g vitamin c. All the calories for both lime and kiwifruit is sugars, so it seems kiwifruit can actually provide more vitamin c with less sugar

Good point about the shipping though. I don't like to eat berries. I really don't like eating any fruit with skins (the skins would be pretty impossible to remove on berries).

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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #15 on: December 13, 2009, 08:48:39 am »
Quote from: invisible on December 13, 2009, 07:45:47 am
I don't think I have deficiencies but getting some more might help, I know it is said to help damaged skin which I have. Shellfish are an option but not a consistent reliable source I can have each day I think.
So you want to eat vitamin C every day? What is the skin issue?
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #16 on: December 13, 2009, 09:50:05 am »
Quote from: PaleoPhil on December 13, 2009, 08:48:39 am
So you want to eat vitamin C every day? What is the skin issue?

Yeah?

And I have sun damaged skin and acne scars
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2009, 10:48:34 am »
There's no guarantee it will help, but I'll share what I learned from my own experience and research in dealing with my past acne and acne scarring issue.

Much of my acne cleared up and some of my acne scarring and enlarged pores partly healed when I eliminated gluten and dairy from my diet and adopted a conventional Paleo diet. I found that zinc supplements got rid of the remaining acne. Then when I added more fruits, squashes and nightshades back into my diet, my acne increasingly returned and I had to take a larger dose of zinc on a daily basis to keep it at bay.

I continued to search for a way to prevent the acne without having to take supplements. When I went raw carnivore the acne essentially disappeared and the scarring and pores healed further, although I still have one mild depressed acne scar in my most scarred area, but it is not noticeable to most people. I used to think that acne scars could not heal through dietary change, but I learned that at least mild scarring can.

For me, the key nutritional factors seemed to be zinc and fatty acids from red meats and animal and fish fats. Vitamin A is also considered an important skin nutrient, and prescription derivatives from it (retin-A and isotretinoin) were my most effective pharmaceutical treatments (but still not nearly as effective as dietary change), so vitamin A was probably another factor in my dietary healing.

Here are some references linking zinc to acne and skin healing:

"[Z]inc is closely involved in protein synthesis and in collagen formation in your body, both of which are essential in the maintenance of healthy skin and in normalizing production of skin oils." (Use of Zinc for Acne, http://www.nutritional-supplements-health-guide.com/zinc-for-acne.html)

"Zinc is also a crucial element in the production of collagen, elastin, new placement cells and tissue substances. These all make up the repair process in acne infected sites." ("Does zinc heal acne?" December 10, 2006 http://curingacne.blogspot.com/2006/12/does-zinc-heal-acne.html)

James F. Balch, M.D. and Phyllis A. Balch, C.N.C. in Prescription for Nutritional Healing list "Zinc gluconate 30-80 mg daily to aid in the healing of tissue and to prevent scarring."
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>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline invisible

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #18 on: December 13, 2009, 12:03:27 pm »
I tried accutane in the past, though it failed (in hindsight it's fortunate that it did or I probably would have never found this way of eating). I did clear acne with this diet and the scars are incredibly better since starting. I eat plenty of red meat and Dr Ron's liver capsules so I am getting plenty of zinc and vitamin A which has clearly been extremely beneficial. I still have sun damage though rough skin, freckle spots which improved but perhaps vitamin C might speed up skin healing along with the other vitamins I now am getting. Damage might be too deep and needs lasers or something. I know that vitamin C is used in skin ointments and said to make you less prone to sunburn. Whether its true or not I am not sure but interesting to test.

Sometimes my gums bleed when I am stressed. The adrenals contain vitamin C and excrete vitamin C as part of the stress response. This is why I was looking to get some adrenals for the vitamin C + heal the adrenals from any burnout they probably have. Hard to get fresh grass fed organs in any substantial quantity though, so can only use the dried supplements for the moment.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 12:13:27 pm by invisible »
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Offline PaleoPhil

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #19 on: December 13, 2009, 09:26:46 pm »
Quote from: invisible on December 13, 2009, 12:03:27 pm
...perhaps vitamin C might speed up skin healing along with the other vitamins I now am getting. Damage might be too deep and needs lasers or something. I know that vitamin C is used in skin ointments and said to make you less prone to sunburn. Whether its true or not I am not sure but interesting to test.
I would be surprised if it accelerates the healing much beyond what you're already experiencing, but there are some reports indicating that it helps, so let us know if you try it and it works for you.
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>"When some one eats an Epi paleo Rx template and follows the rules of circadian biology they get plenty of starches when they are available three out of the four seasons." -Jack Kruse, MD
>"I recommend 20 percent of calories from carbs, depending on the size of the person" -Ron Rosedale, MD (in other words, NOT zero carbs) http://preview.tinyurl.com/6ogtan
>Finding a diet you can tolerate is not the same as fixing what's wrong. -Tim Steele
Beware of problems from chronic Very Low Carb

Offline raw

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2009, 04:45:37 am »
why we can't choose to eat dried rose hips, which are loaded on vit C. well, i order some fresh thyroid glands and i'm getting them on Thursday.
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Offline raw

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2009, 04:46:11 am »
why we can't choose to eat dried rose hips, which are loaded on vit C. well, i order some fresh thyroid glands and i'm getting them on Thursday.
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Offline RawZi

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #22 on: December 16, 2009, 11:34:55 am »
    Do thyroids have much C?  Did you need a prescription?  I heard they're pretty powerful.  Enjoy them.  Will you freeze them?  I want to hear more.
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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #23 on: December 16, 2009, 12:46:49 pm »
Quote from: RawZi on December 16, 2009, 11:34:55 am
    Do thyroids have much C?  Did you need a prescription?  I heard they're pretty powerful.  Enjoy them.  Will you freeze them?  I want to hear more.
dear rawzi, this is the 1st time i'm getting them. my mom is coming this Friday, so, i can feed her that. i really don't know about vit C in thyroid glands, but i'm not into strict ZC diet, so i can get my vit C plenty in other ways.  past experience taught me that extreme of anything is bad. i'm looking forward to meet you in this Saturday. thanks.
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Offline RawZi

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Re: vitamin C in dried meat
« Reply #24 on: December 16, 2009, 02:36:32 pm »
Quote from: raw on December 16, 2009, 12:46:49 pm
don't know about vit C in thyroid glands, but i'm not into strict ZC diet, so i can get my vit C plenty in other ways.  past experience taught me that extreme of anything

    I read to take thyroid together with liver, pituitary, adrenal, thymus and fat, otherwise you can get heart racing that might be very dangerous.  I don't know; because I haven't tried it.  Good luck.  Do you have any idea how big the thyroid is?  I haven't even seen it.  I have read it's dangerous to eat it cooked in uncontrolled dose.
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