How important is coconut cream?

[majormark]

For those that make coconut cream, I have a question: why do you do it? and how?

It took me about 3 hours to get it out of 5 coconuts and I think I also cracked the auger of my slow juicer... So at this point I'm wondering if it's actually worth it when I compare it to raw butter. The price/quantity is about 4 times more for the coconut cream (not including my time here).

Maybe a twin gear juicer would work better, but it costs double and it would still take a loooong time to make.

On the plus side it does taste better than raw butter.

[TylerDurden]

I've heard that the only reliable juicer for the Primal Diet is the GreenStar (twin-gear?) juicer. It's hideously expensive but, apparently, if you're a committed juicer, then it works out cheaper in the long run as it extracts more juice from the food than other juicers. Plus, apparently, you can get parts replaced quite easily without having to buy a whole new juicer if things go wrong.

[goodsamaritan]

Are coconuts native in Romania?

Coconuts are plenty in my country so I don't bother making cream.  I just eat and drink straight from the soft meat kind of coconut.

[majormark]

Coconuts are not native in Romania, but in the last years the summers got hotter so people started to think about planting some tropical trees. Just a little more global warming and we might get there.

I'm still looking for more motivation to continue making the cream.

Alternatively I could only stick with vegetable juices because it seems that it would take a full metal auger to squeeze the mature coconuts properly.

[William]

For those that make coconut cream, I have a question: why do you do it? and how?

It took me about 3 hours to get it out of 5 coconuts and I think I also cracked the auger of my slow juicer... So at this point I'm wondering if it's actually worth it when I compare it to raw butter. The price/quantity is about 4 times more for the coconut cream (not including my time here).

Maybe a twin gear juicer would work better, but it costs double and it would still take a loooong time to make.

On the plus side it does taste better than raw butter.

I made it 6 years ago because I was doing the Primal diet.

The trick is to warm the slices of coconut meat to about 37C - it won't break the green whatsit machine then.
I broke parts on my juicer a few times before I learned that,  and the manufacturer always sent me replacement parts free without question.

I began to hate the too-sweet taste, and about half the coconuts were sour or rancid or whatever happens to them if they are too old.

Butter would be better.

[wodgina]

I'm an ex-primal dieter. We had a green whats-it-machine. Don't do it, coconut cream becomes sickly, gut cramping , gunk.

[goodsamaritan]

I second this observation.  Coconut cream causes gut cramps.  It's not for kids.  And adults can only tolerate a tiny bit.

I once made the mistake of allowing my then 3 year old 2nd son to drink 1/2 glass of coconut cream and his gut cramped out for days. http://www.myhealthblog.org/2007/05/26/coconut-milk-gives-tummy-ache-to-3-year-old-boy/

We solved this by giving him activated charcoal in half a glass of water then using a colon cleanser to flush everything out.

Raw animal fats are soothing.  Choose animal fats.

Like so...

[majormark]

That was kind of what I was thinking

I can say that I ate all the cream from the 5 coconuts with little lemon juice in two sittings the same day and did not experience gut cramps. Perhaps it manifests in the long term.

[van]

there's a big big difference in the quality/freshness and fat content of coconuts.  As they mature, their fat content increases.  Young coconuts are almost an entire different specie.  When buying coconuts that have been shipped, my experience is that almost half of them are on their way out in terms of going moldy.  So, be picky and if experimenting,  use only the ones that taste really good and chuck the rest, or as I do give them to your chickens or some other bird in your neighborhood.

[Ioanna]

I made it once.. the taste is divine!... but I definitely agree with the gut cramps that manifest quickly for me and is the reason I'll not ever make it again. I didn't break any juicer parts, but it did get warm so I gave it some cooling time frequently.

[Furion]

Phew.. I was about to make a thread on coconut cream.  I thought I was the only one.

Coconut cream makes me feel nauseous and give me diarreah.

Is it possible the nauseous feeling is the fat pulling toxins out of cells?

anyway im gonna stick with animal fat.

[wodgina]

No its not detoxing anything from your cells.

You were poisoned by salicylates.

CO is very high in these.

[carnivore]

No its not detoxing anything from your cells.

You were poisoned by salicylates.

CO is very high in these.

Any references ?

[RawZi]

No its not detoxing anything from your cells.

You were poisoned by salicylates.

CO is very high in these.

    Vegetable oils can leave inflammation in their wakes.  CO is a vegetarian oil.  Vegetable oils can be used for cleansing and really can't nourish much.  Put coconut oil or typical salicylic based acne medications on skin and it takes out dead skin flakes and puss and oil of your body may draw up and pour out these now newly unclogged pores.  I'm not sure CO is exactly a poison, but it is not a living food.  It's an abrasive solvent perhaps, depending on the material around.     

[William]

     Put coconut oil or typical salicylic based acne medications on skin and it takes out dead skin flakes and puss and oil of your body may draw up and pour out these now newly unclogged pores.  I'm not sure CO is exactly a poison, but it is not a living food.  It's an abrasive solvent perhaps, depending on the material around.     

Is it possible that it would remove blackheads?

[RawZi]

Is it possible that it would remove blackheads?

    AV in his books recommend(ed)+(s) coconut cream to help remove scars.  I will assume that it can help do that to blackheads too.  I would experiment on mine to find out, but I have no blackheads left and the only noticeable scar I have remaining since I'm eating RAF is a pockmark.  I don't think there's a natural way the body rids itself of that.

[PaleoPhil]

Coconut oil is well known to cause nausea and diarrhea in some people. The nausea and diarrhea are called "detox" by some, but in some people it never goes away, so unless you think all nausea and diarrhea to be detox, I don't think they qualify as necessarily being detox in this case.

Many people advise to start slowly, such as here: "Start slowly; giving your body a full dosage of coconut oil without allowing it to become accustomed to the oil can cause serious nausea and diarrhea." (http://www.ehow.com/how_5191839_raw-coconut-oil.html). I read this advice before trying EVCO, and followed it, starting out with very small amounts and increasing gradually. I still developed the nausea as soon as the amounts creaped up beyond a very small level and it continued no matter how long I continued to take the EVCO and no matter how gradual I tried to increase the amounts. Instead of decreasing, the nausea increased over time, so that even a small amount of EVCO caused nausea, and I ended up throwing out the last jar of that stuff. EVCO turned out to be a very unpleasant product for me.

In contrast, raw tallow has never given me this side effect, no matter how much I eat of it and I didn't have to start out with small amounts to avoid nausea. I wonder what causes the difference?

[Ioanna]

even small amounts of coconut oil give me nausea while animal fats just make me feel sated

[PaleoPhil]

I searched my notes from here and elsewhere and did some additional googling and think I may have an answer as to why coconut oil is much more likely to cause nausea than suet. From Carnivore, Rawlion I learned that short- and medium-chain triglycerides (MCTs) are metabolised more quickly than long-chain and very long-chain tryglycerides. Sort of like sugar. MCTs "are more water-soluble than ... long-chained types of triglycerides and are able to be used quickly by the body as an energy source. ... Due to their smaller carbon chains, medium chain triglycerides can be absorbed directly by the wall of the small intestine." Whereas long-chain triglycerides are metabolized more slowly. "Long-chain triglycerides and very long-chained triglycerides require the action of pancreatic enzymes and bile salts for digestion. They need to be transported into the blood stream from the intestine via a part of the lymphatic system called the intestinal lacteals." (http://www.ehow.com/about_5192023_medium-chain-triglycerides_.html)

Coconut oil contains high levels of short and medium chain triglycerides (66% MCTs according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium-chain_triglycerides), whereas suet contains mostly long chain triglycerides. For example, one of coconut oil's MCTs is capric acid. Capric acid can be processed into caprylic acid, which is known to cause nausea and diarrhea in sensitive people: "Caprylic acid is absorbed through the walls of the intestines and can cause nausea. It should not be taken by people who have ulcerative colitis." (Coconut Oil, http://www.kombuchahealth.com.au/coconut_oil.html)

So it looks like the rapid metabolization of MCTs from coconut oil can flood a sensitive person's system faster than it can deal with it, causing the GI system to be overwhelmed, leading to nausea and sometimes resulting in the body trying to expel the excess MCT through vomiting and/or diarrhea. So rather than a detox of existing toxins in the body, it looks like it's an expelling of excess MCTs.

The lengthy process it takes to digest the LCTs in suet may also partly answer the question of why some people get undigested suet in their stool. I recently noticed I often have some small undigested bits of suet and meat in my stools too. Either they were small enough that I didn't notice them at first or my digestion has taken a turn for the worse--I suspect the former. My digestion has improved over what it used to be, but it looks like I have a ways further to go.

[majormark]

The trick is to warm the slices of coconut meat to about 37C - it won't break the green whatsit machine then.
...

How did you measure the temperature? Was it watery when it came out of the juicer?

I tried heating it by placing the slices on the radiator until they were warm to the touch. No idea if they got too warm, but I noticed that what was coming out of the juicer was something watery (about the consistency of milk), which got more creamy as it sat for 30 minutes.

[William]

Been a while, but I think I put it in a pot of warm water, water temp ~37C, for a while.
The product was like milk, same as your experience.

[majormark]

Today I had some time to kill and I thought I'd make some coconut cream again.

The timing has been improved because I managed to do 2 coconuts in 1.5 h and probably could have been even less that 1 hour if I optimized things a little.

I attached some pics to get you a visual idea of how much cream can be obtained from 2 coconuts. Definitely a lot more cream can be obtained when they are warm.

[Furion]

1.5 hrs?  

If anyone wants a tip... before you pierce the coconut for it's water and break it open... tap/bounce it against the concrete/hard floor repeatedly and the vibrations help loosen the coconut meat from it's shell. Do it hard but not quite hard enough so the coconut smashes open. It also depends on the coconut.. maybe where you are they are different.  Sometimes I get lucky and the coconut meat will be so loose I can do it in a few mins but other times it might take 10-15 mins.

[goodsamaritan]

In our country, everyone makes coconut cream for cooking.
I was having a chat with the coconut vendor / grater / cream maker.

It is common knowledge (among filipinos) you cannot eat too much raw coconut cream or your stomach will ache / crap out / get upset.
Plus raw coconut cream will go rancid in a few short hours.
I told him some foreigners have taken up drinking lots of raw coconut cream.
He thinks they're nuts.

I think some people have iron stomachs and can handle lots of raw coconut cream.  Lucky you. 

[RawZi]

When I first moved to the tropics, I was introduced to fresh coconut water.  I liked it.  I was told that lots of people can't drink it.  That it causes bad diarrhea and many other problems.  I drank one, two, three, four, five, six, seven in a row, no effect except a feeling of wellness.  More than seven just didn't sound right to me, as each coconut had about 24 oz fluid.  I drank seven coconuts every day for about a year, but little other food.  I felt very well. 

I had not found coconut cream yet.  I like that too, but it kind of reminds me of those coconut soap bars.  I don't like eating things that remind me of soap. 

I was having a chat with the coconut vendor / grater / cream maker.

It is common knowledge (among filipinos) you cannot eat too much raw coconut cream or your stomach will ache / crap out / get upset.
...
I told him some foreigners have taken up drinking lots of raw coconut cream.
He thinks they're nuts.

I think some people have iron stomachs and can handle lots of raw coconut cream.  Lucky you. 

Nuts for coconuts!  Yup, some of us raw high fat food eaters are nutty for a time, but it's a sane kind of nuttiness.  Here's a coconut group I made: http://tinyurl.com/9grhhq, one of the higher member number groups of GI2MR.   

(If u're confused after/by this link I changed that ID the first time just that day [but got ban not hrs later] for a boy in deadly coma who I'd just known twelve years earlier as a straight A respected student)

Goodsamaritan, when I've coconut cream it comes out a little too thick to drink?  What's the filipino trick to making it thin enough to just drink really at all?  When I buy raw coconut cream, it's even thicker than mine, to the extent even difficult to scoop.