Is chilli or cayenne bad for you?

[TylerDurden]

Given that I'm testing a raw carnivore diet, whereas Richard Schulze apparently follows a vegan diet (is it cooked vegan?), and given that no shamanic society has every followed a vegan diet, I think you can guess what my opinion of his work would be.

  Same applies in that there are no genuine raw zero carb tribes as they eat raw berries or seaweed at various times of the year. For example, the Inuit in the relevant wikipedia entry are described as storing foods like seaweeds, frozen berries etc:-
While it is not possible to cultivate plants for food in the Arctic the Inuit have traditionally gathered those that are naturally available. Grasses, tubers, roots, stems, berries, and seaweed (kuanniq or edible seaweed) were collected and preserved depending on the season and the location."
"

[PaleoPhil]

He doesnt promote a vegan diet,

I didn't say he promotes a vegan diet, I said he "apparently follows a cooked vegan diet." I found the following:

"[Dr. Ron Shulze] became a vegan, began an intensive exercise program and literally changed everything that went in and out of his body, mind and spirit." https://www.herbdoc.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=37&Itemid=106

I treated that conservatively, not saying that he is promoting a vegan diet, because it doesn't literally tell others to follow it, even though it is on his website and it certainly comes across as suggesting that a vegan diet is a good thing, with no caveats about it not necessarily being good for everyone. Is that the Ron Schulze that you're referring to and has he since abandoned his vegan diet?

For example Dr. Schulze on how expertly he uses cayenne pepper to heal people from gangrene & save people from heart attacks ....

He seems to be recommending taking the cayenne on a continuous and long-term basis, yes? For chronic problems like heart disease I would prefer to use a raw Paleo diet low in plant toxins and antinutrients (found in reportedly relatively high concentrations in grains, legumes, nightshades and nuts, as compared to fruits, meats, fish/seafood and insects), so I'm increasingly less impressed by Dr. Schulze's work the more you reveal. Sorry. I see plant medicines as more appropriate for acute illnesses and acute flares of chronic illnesses. I don't believe plant medicines should be taken chronically if it can be avoided, just as with synthetic medicines.

I actually tried cayenne in the past for my poor circulation and hair loss after reading articles by people with similar views and claims to those of Dr. Schulze and after hearing about one person's anecdotal claims of benefit. The cayenne provided me with no noticeable benefits, whereas eliminating all nightshades including cayenne and going raw carnivore greatly improved my circulation and body temperature regulation. I'm not making claims or recommendations for anyone else on this, just sharing my own experience and research, both of which are at odds with what Dr. Schulze claims about this. People may wish to investigate the research I provided above and the ingredients and processing methods of Schulze before they buy any of Schulze's products. In general I advocate skeptically questioning claims and openness about information. If you're going to tout Dr. Schulze on a RPD forum you should reveal why you're doing that despite the fact that he doesn't appear to advocate RPD (and if he now does you can update us on that).

[PaleoPhil]

 Same applies in that there are no genuine raw zero carb tribes as they eat raw berries or seaweed at various times of the year.

Correct and I have pointed that out myself, including at the ZC forum (and took flack for it). Which is one reason why I call myself a raw facultative carnivore rather than a raw ZCer. As I have pointed out many times before, even wolves and coyotes eat berries. I didn't say that eating any plant foods is not Paleo. I'm even planning on trying wild berries and other in-season fruits this summer. However, RPD is not about trying to literally emulate every aspect of HG diet and lifestyle to the letter regardless of negative consequences, which you also do not do (for example, traditional Inuits also cooked some of their foods and you don't do that). It's about using knowledge about Paleolithic nutrition and human metabolism to try to optimize our diets today in a way that is customized for our own individual needs. I don't know why I seem to do even better on an obligate carnivore diet than facultative, but it could be due to past damage from SAD, or it could be that berries and seaweed do not further optimize my diet beyond what meat/fat/organs do. Just because HGs eat those other foods does not guarantee that they are optimally healthy.

At any rate, my point was not that no one should eat any plant foods. I was asked my opinion of Schulze, I read at his website that he followed a (cooked) vegan diet that is not RPD and saw that he was selling products that are not RPD and gave my preliminary opinion based on what I've read. If it turns out that he has since adopted a RPD diet and promotes that and he has stopped selling his non-RPD products, I will update my opinion. You're not advocating Schulze's recommendations, are you?

[goodsamaritan]

When my brother was sick and in an emergency room in a hospital which could do nothing about his breathing problem, I saved the day by having him chew on 2 fresh cayenne pieces. It took 10 mins to take effect.

I decided to make cayenne tincture so next time, it will only take a minute.

Cayenne tincture is popular with my wife and in laws and friends who are not raw paleo.  Clears sinuses, mucus, soar throat, etc.  I have none of those, like you, I'm on raw paleo. 

Cayenne powder has saved our household from cuts, and bleeding injuries.  No need for stitches, no need for emergency rooms, just slap it on.

I gave away cayenne tinctures in small bottles to friends and relatives.  I know it saved a friend who cancelled her sinus operation because the cayenne cleared her sinuses.

[jessica]

    I loved hanging out with the old ladies in the rainforest.

ha! where did you do this? that is my dream!  have you heard of the thirteen grandmothers?  they are 13 shaman women from tribes all around the earth, the have set up a forest healing center as well as a Institute of Natural and Traditional Medicine Seed Bank
http://www.grandmotherscouncil.com/

some times i wake up with mucus, mostly from sleeping inside, second hand smoke from my neighbors, or the slight begining of a sickness(thats usually as far as it goes), if i make a garlic, cayenne, kelp broth with maybe a piece of liver or something, it kicks out the germs, clears any mucus and generally feels stimulating...so i say yes to cayenne in medicinal doses

[roony]

  Same applies in that there are no genuine raw zero carb tribes as they eat raw berries or seaweed at various times of the year. For example, the Inuit in the relevant wikipedia entry are described as storing foods like seaweeds, frozen berries etc:-
While it is not possible to cultivate plants for food in the Arctic the Inuit have traditionally gathered those that are naturally available. Grasses, tubers, roots, stems, berries, and seaweed (kuanniq or edible seaweed) were collected and preserved depending on the season and the location."
"

Excellent post, we have herbs, roots & spices in our environment for a reason & we need herbalists naturopaths with their knowledge of nature, to help us where paleo diets dont work

There are plenty of dangerous strains of parasites & mutated forms of bacteria, a paleo diet will not protect you from, fortunately for us the advanced immune systems of the cows & animals we consume, kill most of those for us

Which is WHY we dont eat soil & grass & leaves, UNLESS theyre specifically edible for humans, they contain dangerous strains of parasites & bacteria FOREIGN to the human body


The birds & animals & insects around us CONSUME incompatible parasites & bacteria from the air around us, they also recycle the toxic gases & radiations of the sun & our solar system

Birds & animals & insects & plants, are our Secondary Immune System

[PaleoPhil]

Excellent post, we have herbs, roots & spices in our environment for a reason & we need herbalists naturopaths with their knowledge of nature, to help us where paleo diets dont work ....

Yes. While I advocate skepticism and questioning, I do think that there is some value in natural herbal treatments. I found the book Wild Health by Cindy Engel to be interesting. Rather than approaching it from the viewpoint that Schulze seems to on early examination promote (which I will attempt to summarize as "I have found the best way of healing, which includes a vegan diet, and here are my products you can buy that will heal you"), Engel takes the approach of, "Let's look at what the animals do and see what, if anything, we can learn from them."

I tend to be attracted more to an open-minded, investigative approach like the latter than the wisdom-on-high approach and I tend to be skeptical of people who are pushing their own products. That doesn't mean the products can't be good, it's just that I know the seller has an economic motive behind them that doesn't necessarily coincide with my own motive of better personal health for me. Rather than just her own personal experience or high theory, Engel also draws on field observations and laboratory studies. It seems to me that we can learn more from studying animals and people living in the wild or near-wild (ie, wild animals and hunter-gatherers) than we can from one dude who had success with a particular approach and is selling products. For example, I would recommend that people put less import on what I say based on my personal experience than they do in their own personal experience and observations of wild animals and HGs (by themselves or credible sources) in a near-Paleo-type environment (ie, wilderness). What works for me may not necessarily work for you and my modern environment is not the primordial laboratory conditions that human beings evolved/developed in--which were those of the wilderness of the Paleolithic era. In other words, I am less persuaded of something because Dr. Schulze says it's so, than I am because we observe it in the actions of the animals and HGs in the original laboratory conditions of humans (countless generations of living in wilderness or near-wilderness) and find it produces beneficial results in a host of them and then find we can make predictions based on these observations and that we can benefit ourselves from what we've learned.

I'm trying not to be too hard on Schulze, since I only so far have to go on what has been said here and what is on his website, but the more he is cited without supporting evidence to beat anyone who disagrees with him about the head for how wrong they are and how beneficial cayenne is, which is something I tried and didn't work for me, and the more his products are promoted, the more skeptical I become.

[roony]

I've never been interested in his products, just mainly when i couldnt be bothered to make my own lol

I'm more interested in his techniques & idea's

I'll have to look up Engel, any good links?

thnx

[PaleoPhil]

I've never been interested in his products, just mainly when i couldnt be bothered to make my own lol

I'm more interested in his techniques & idea's

A wise emphasis when coupled with skepticism, IMO.

I'll have to look up Engel, any good links?

thnx

The book is searchable at Amazon.com.

[RawZi]

I gave away cayenne tinctures in small bottles to friends and relatives.  I know it saved a friend who cancelled her sinus operation because the cayenne cleared her sinuses.

    Same here, just today, but my friend ate a marble size balls of high meats rather than cayenne.  Well, it was just an appointment for this wk, not an operation, but she was very sick for several weeks and nothing worked until she tried her first himeat ever, just this morning.

    She said it feels so right, she will never go to a doctor again.

[roony]

   Same here, just today, but my friend ate a marble size balls of high meats rather than cayenne.  Well, it was just an appointment for this wk, not an operation, but she was very sick for several weeks and nothing worked until she tried her first himeat ever, just this morning.

    She said it feels so right, she will never go to a doctor again.

Nice

There is a lot of studies & research supporting Schulzes work, which is in contrast to Aajonus, which is why i like Schulzes work so much, his understanding of physiology & naturopathiology is stunning


If my own research didnt coincide with Schulze or Aajonus i wouldnt be posting here lol

[PaleoPhil]

Nice

There is a lot of studies & research supporting Schulzes work, which is in contrast to Aajonus, which is why i like Schulzes work so much, his understanding of physiology & naturopathiology is stunning


If my own research didnt coincide with Schulze or Aajonus i wouldnt be posting here lol

You didn't fully answer any of my questions about Schulze and so far I'm not particularly impressed with either Schulze or Aajonus (although I did learn a little bit from Aajonus' writings/interviews and he is one of the few prominent people who advocate raw meat), yet I post here nonetheless.

I'll try again. From Schulze's website I found: "[Dr. Ron Schulze] became a vegan, began an intensive exercise program and literally changed everything that went in and out of his body, mind and spirit." (https://www.herbdoc.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=37&Itemid=106) Is that the Ron Schulze that you're referring to? The diet he referred to there was cooked vegan, correct (normally people specify raw if their diet is raw)? What is his diet currently?

Schulze seems to be recommending taking cayenne on a continuous and long-term basis, yes?

roony wrote: "[Schulze] understands human biology & physiology, better then aajonus & cordain put together...."

OK, I'll bite. What does Schulze understand so much better than Cordain?

...    She said it feels so right, she will never go to a doctor again.

I wouldn't advise that. If nothing else, doctors can measure various health markers so you can make sure you're on the right track (though you may need to persuade your physician to check the right markers--which you can find about from Dr. William Davis of Heartscan and Dr. Kurt Harris of PaNu).

[roony]

I wasnt under the impression you wanted any info about Schulze, lol

I'm not about write a biography about schulze, you can google sam biser, for his excellent interviews with schulze, or look up barefoot hebalist, as goodsamaritan mentioned

He basically modernised herbology & naturopathy & brought alternative medicine upto date, into an effective & powerful, a devestating healing medium

One of the biggest alternative health forums on the internet, CUREZONE.com was created solely because of richard schulze, as he popularised effective techniques to heal aids & cancer patients, without dangerous poisonous drugs, using the physiology of the human body


Richard Schulze isnt an ordinary herbalist, he's what i would call an EXTREME herbalist lol

He does crazy things with herbs, like using herbs to pulling tumours right out of your body & curing terminally ill patients, especially aids patients


He's well known for using simple herbs like cayenne, for healing stuff like chronic heart conditions, gangrene etc., he basically improved & popularised on the techniques one of the best herbalists of our time, Dr John R Christopher

He's also talked about regrowing organs, like damaged hearts etc., with herbs, stuff like pulling out tumours using poultices, regrowing tissues where doctors declared arms & legs had to be amputated

He's also famous for one of the most effective & extreme techniques for curing cancer & aids, the cold sheet technique

This just happens to be one of the most advanced detox techniques, in naturopathy today

[PaleoPhil]

...I'm not about write a biography about schulze, you can google sam biser, for his excellent interviews with schulze, or look up barefoot hebalist, as goodsamaritan mentioned

I'm not looking for a biography, just brief answers to my questions.

He basically modernised herbology & naturopathy & brought alternative medicine upto date, into an effective & powerful, a devestating healing medium

I'm looking for specifics, not generalities. They can be just a few, brief specifics or even a single example of where Schulze's understanding of human biology and physiology greatly exceeds Cordains'.

Richard Schulze isnt an ordinary herbalist, he's what i would call an EXTREME herbalist lol

He does crazy things with herbs, like using herbs to pulling tumours right out of your body & curing terminally ill patients, especially aids patients

The more I learn about this dude, the more my alarm bells go off. I think a more apt term to describe that than crazy would be charlatanism. The pulling-tumors-out trick is an old scam.

He's also talked about regrowing organs, like damaged hearts etc., with herbs, stuff like pulling out tumours using poultices, ....

Sounds like more charlatanism. Talking about stuff and making extraordinary claims is not evidence of knowledge or efficacy. As Sagan said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence (from a practical standpoint, rather than a philosophical one). Anyone can make extraordinary claims, what's more difficult is providing hard evidence to back them up.

He's also famous for one of the most effective & extreme techniques for curing cancer & aids, the cold sheet technique

If it's so famous, how come I've never heard of it? If half of what you say is true about this guy Schulze, he's making Aajonus seem more and more reasonable.

If you keep promoting Schulze here, this non-RPD guy who has an air of charlatanism (based on what you've shared and his website), I predict that Tyler will have a field day with him, and he'll probably be less gentle about it than I've been. Especially if you continue to not directly answer the questions about him that are posed.

[goodsamaritan]

We're going off topic again for the nth time....

Maybe you guys can discuss personalities in an off topic thread?  Aptly name it for the personalities you want to critique on?

[roony]

I'm not looking for a biography, just brief answers to my questions.
I'm looking for specifics, not generalities. They can be just a few, brief specifics or even a single example of where Schulze's understanding of human biology and physiology greatly exceeds Cordains'.
The more I learn about this dude, the more my alarm bells go off. I think a more apt term to describe that than crazy would be charlatanism. The pulling-tumors-out trick is an old scam.
Sounds like more charlatanism. Talking about stuff and making extraordinary claims is not evidence of knowledge or efficacy. As Sagan said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence (from a practical standpoint, rather than a philosophical one). Anyone can make extraordinary claims, what's more difficult is providing hard evidence to back them up.
If it's so famous, how come I've never heard of it? If half of what you say is true about this guy Schulze, he's making Aajonus seem more and more reasonable.

If you keep promoting Schulze here, this non-RPD guy who has an air of charlatanism (based on what you've shared and his website), I predict that Tyler will have a field day with him, and he'll probably be less gentle about it than I've been. Especially if you continue to not directly answer the questions about him that are posed.

If you're going to be an asshole about it, go use google, i've got better things to do

[PaleoPhil]

Critiquing views and actions supported by evidence or logic is fine, but I find completely personal insults to be unpersuasive and a mark of a weak case. You insulted Loren Cordain and now me without backing it up with evidence or logic. I'm not seeking to promote Schulze or any of his extraordinary claims here. The burden or proof lies with anyone who does. If you intend to make any further claims then I suggest you do it in a separate thread, per GS' suggestion. If you don't intend to answer my questions or mention him again, then I have no further interest in him and won't waste time investigating his views or discussing him or his work further.

[roony]

My statement still stands, if you dont have the manners or politeness to ask people for information, that is exactly what you'll get called

Dont waste my time, if you've already closed your mind regards the subject, thnx

[goodsamaritan]

Back to cayenne please?  

Some other newbies are reading the forums to learn about health rather than the bickering.

Any other bickering posts below my post will be deleted.