Tapeworms.

[miles]

Humans rely on on their environment to stay alive too. It doesn't mean they won't cripple and exploit it.

If there is so much good in faeces, why would it be faeces?

Why would we need bacteria to digest meat? We have stomach acid which is meant to kill bacteria and if they survive in to the intestines that's not a good thing. We have acids, enzymes and emulsifiers (etc..) to digest the meat/fat. Bacteria living in the large intestine live off what we were unable to digest, of which there should be little.

It's not a blind fear. If something can continue to survive and reproduce, it'll continue to exist. It doesn't care as such how it does it. One organism could live off of another's undigested food peacefully for a life time, passing out eggs or copies in its' hosts' faeces and perhaps be beneficial, causing a little bit of gas but by chance also stopping the person's system from getting clogged up. If the parasitic organism(eu or prokaryotik) wasn't there, perhaps the host organism would've either died out or needed to evolve some other system for preventing blockage.

Another parasite could find a way of sending its' eggs in to the blood-stream to wait in cysts, then to hatch-out and use the surrounding host-cells for food. It doesn't matter if it kills its' host because something else will eat the host and the cycle can begin again. It could even(through selection) lie dormant for a period by which its' preferred host-species would usually have produced off-spring, if it struggles to survive in other hosts.  Either that, or you could get parasites which can live symbiotically with one host, but be greatly detrimental to another.

[Hannibal]

Why would we need bacteria to digest meat?

Bacteria together with enzymes digest the meat before we eat it.
So it's of paramount importance to age all of the muscle-meats and some organ-meats; the digestion will be much better.

[miles]

But... the bacteria will be converting useful compounds, compounds which we could react within our body to release energy, in to useless compounds...?

[Hannibal]

No. The bacteria will be converting these compounds into more bioavailable and better digestable ones.
The same situation is with raw fresh milk, which is much more harder to digest than the fermented one.
The same is with raw cabbage and the fermented one - sauerkraut.

[Spearhead]

Humans rely on on their environment to stay alive too. It doesn't mean they won't cripple and exploit it.

If there is so much good in faeces, why would it be faeces?

Why would we need bacteria to digest meat? We have stomach acid which is meant to kill bacteria and if they survive in to the intestines that's not a good thing. We have acids, enzymes and emulsifiers (etc..) to digest the meat/fat. Bacteria living in the large intestine live off what we were unable to digest, of which there should be little.

It's not a blind fear. If something can continue to survive and reproduce, it'll continue to exist. It doesn't care as such how it does it. One organism could live off of another's undigested food peacefully for a life time, passing out eggs or copies in its' hosts' faeces and perhaps be beneficial, causing a little bit of gas but by chance also stopping the person's system from getting clogged up. If the parasitic organism(eu or prokaryotik) wasn't there, perhaps the host organism would've either died out or needed to evolve some other system for preventing blockage.

Another parasite could find a way of sending its' eggs in to the blood-stream to wait in cysts, then to hatch-out and use the surrounding host-cells for food. It doesn't matter if it kills its' host because something else will eat the host and the cycle can begin again. It could even(through selection) lie dormant for a period by which its' preferred host-species would usually have produced off-spring, if it struggles to survive in other hosts.  Either that, or you could get parasites which can live symbiotically with one host, but be greatly detrimental to another.

Really I am shocked. I don't even know what to say here. If you believe in the Germ Theory what are you doing eating raw? If you really believe bacteria has nothing to do with digestion, try a course of antibiotics for a month and see how you feel.

Stomach acid killing bacteria? That is an outright fraud. Bacteria works beautifully in conjunction with stomach acid to facilitate digestion, it is not harmed by it. But again, don't take my word for it, try a course of antibiotics for a month, if you are right, you will have nothing to lose.

[miles]

Well, then those will be the ones which have evolved alongside us, non-harmfully and which we could even have developed a certain amount of dependence for. That does not mean that all bacteria are nice and want to look after us, they don't do it to be nice, they just 'found' a niche.

[Hannibal]

That does not mean that all bacteria are nice and want to look after us, they don't do it to be nice, they just 'found' a niche.

You're right that not all the bacteria are beneficial - the natural balance between good ones and bad ones is what it's really important.
If you eat cooked foods you you've got zero good bateria, because they are anihilated and you'll only get bad bacteria, which develop after some time.

[Spearhead]

You're right that not all the bacteria are beneficial - the natural balance between good ones and bad ones is what it's really important.
If you eat cooked foods you you've got zero good bateria, because they are anihilated and you'll only get bad bacteria, which develop after some time.

This is also not true. There is no such thing as a harmful bacteria. This is like substantiating the fraudulent claim that bacteria causes tooth decay, when it is the detox of the brains heavy metals and chemicals out of the dentine that causes the decay, at which point bacteria occupies the decay to keep it from becoming a cesspool. Bacteria our bodies don't actively work in conjunction with are there as janitors to clean out dead cells. The only harmful bacteria are bacterial mutations made in a laboratory.

[Hannibal]

This is also not true. There is no such thing as a harmful bacteria.  

What about Clostridium botulinum, Bacillus anthracis, Clostridium tetani or Vibrio cholerae? Do you think that they all are beneficial? If so, have you got any proof?

[Spearhead]

What about Clostridium botulinum, Bacillus anthracis, Clostridium tetani or Vibrio cholerae? Do you think that they all are beneficial? If so, have you got any proof?

Regarding botulism, my suspicion is that this is another man-made mutated agent. The rural third world never sees incidents of botulism due to a lack of canned food sources and possible contaminants placed by food companies. Anthrax as it is used in biological warfare is without a doubt a mutated agent of man, I don't really think its necessary to substantiate that one further. As for cholera and others, I'm not sure, but given that it has a tendency to be absorbed through drinking contaminated waters in third world countries, I strongly suspect it is caused by toxic runoffs of some sort from certain industrial dumping grounds. Especially when you consider it only came into wide proliferation at the beginning of the industrial age. In this case it might not be a deliberately laboratory-made mutation, rather it could be a janitorial bacteria that exists in light of extreme toxicity in water supplies.

[Hannibal]

Regarding botulism, my suspicion is that this is another man-made mutated agent. 

That's not true. Put the meat into the glass jar, seal it thoroughly, do not air it for a month or so and you'll probably get that Clostridium botulinum. Go to laborabory and they'll tell you.

[Spearhead]

That's not true. Put the meat into the glass jar, seal it thoroughly, do not air it for a month or so and you'll probably get that Clostridium botulinum. Go to laborabory and they'll tell you.

Again, botulism has no pre-industrial age history, which indicates that it is largely a by product of human created toxicity. As for your claim you can create it in a glass jar, I find that highly dubious, and I'm not about to trust any laboratory funded by pharmaceutical companies, which 99.9% are.

[RawZi]

Put the meat into the glass jar, seal it thoroughly, do not air it for a month or so and you'll probably get that Clostridium botulinum. 

    I've done that.  I didn't get sick from eating it (not at all).

[Hannibal]

I've done that.  I didn't get sick from eating it (not at all).

That's what I'm talking about. You're well nourished and have got the good balance, so these kinds of bacteria do not affect you.
But the majority of people could get seriously ill.

[Hannibal]

Again, botulism has no pre-industrial age history, which indicates that it is largely a by product of human created toxicity. As for your claim you can create it in a glass jar, I find that highly dubious, and I'm not about to trust any laboratory funded by pharmaceutical companies, which 99.9% are.

Your arguments are really funny.

[RawZi]

That's what I'm talking about. You're well nourished and have got the good balance, so these kinds of bacteria do not affect you.
But the majority of people could get seriously ill.

    The meat smelled strongly of ammonia.  It kind of felt oxygenating to eat it.  That's the only effect, like smelling salts.

[Spearhead]

Your arguments are really funny.

Why? If you're claiming a healthy person would not be adversely affected by botulism then we are in essence making the same argument, bacteria can only feed on dead or decaying cells, correct? Again though, you have to explain to me how botulism is not a consequence of the industrial age if there is no record of it before then?

[miles]

Who was keeping record?

[van]

I wish that more of us here would take the time if stating a fact to either declare it as an opinion or give a reference.   Most 'facts' are eventually found to be something different, so please, offer references so that 'we' may look into ourselves rather than believe another belief.

[Hannibal]

Why? If you're claiming a healthy person would not be adversely affected by botulism then we are in essence making the same argument, bacteria can only feed on dead or decaying cells, correct? Again though, you have to explain to me how botulism is not a consequence of the industrial age if there is no record of it before then? 

But we live in 2010 year, not in paleo times. We've got a lot of more bacteria, somo of the mutated, some of them man-made - it doesn't matter. What matters is that THEY EXIST and we've got to live with them.
The same bacteria can be nothing for us and for others could by deadly.

[Paleo Donk]

I wish that more of us here would take the time if stating a fact to either declare it as an opinion or give a reference.   Most 'facts' are eventually found to be something different, so please, offer references so that 'we' may look into ourselves rather than believe another belief.

+1

[Spearhead]

But we live in 2010 year, not in paleo times. We've got a lot of more bacteria, somo of the mutated, some of them man-made - it doesn't matter. What matters is that THEY EXIST and we've got to live with them.
The same bacteria can be nothing for us and for others could by deadly.

I don't think we're really disagreeing here, but just to reiterate, I believe all bacteria in its natural, non mutated or genetically altered state is generally a beneficial janitor. Of course our putrid and chemical society changes the equation, but my main point is, it is no way a justification for the Germ Theory which is one of the biggest lies ever told of the last millennium.

[cherimoya_kid]

I don't think we're really disagreeing here, but just to reiterate, I believe all bacteria in its natural, non mutated or genetically altered state is generally a beneficial janitor. Of course our putrid and chemical society changes the equation, but my main point is, it is no way a justification for the Germ Theory which is one of the biggest lies ever told of the last millennium.

How is it that wild animal populations can get decimated by disease?  This has been happening for millions of years.   They are eating their ideal diets.  It's not that I disagree that a very good diet isn't partially protective against microbes.  Yes, it is.  That doesn't mean it is protective against ALL microbes, whether mutated or not. 

You're not being realistic.  We don't live in an ideal world.  Even the pre-human Earth wasn't ideal.  Wild animals DID die of infectious diseases.

[carnivore]

How is it that wild animal populations can get decimated by disease?  This has been happening for millions of years.   They are eating their ideal diets.  It's not that I disagree that a very good diet isn't partially protective against microbes.  Yes, it is.  That doesn't mean it is protective against ALL microbes, whether mutated or not. 

You're not being realistic.  We don't live in an ideal world.  Even the pre-human Earth wasn't ideal.  Wild animals DID die of infectious diseases.

People who visit gorillas in Africa mountains must wear a mask to not contaminate them with human pathogens (it remains only a few hundreds gorillas today).

[Paleo Donk]

Now I am going through such horrible neurological/endocrine detox from 5 years of SSRIs that I've decided to deliberately infuse myself with the Trichinosis whipworm by eating pig intestines. Trichinosis is actually indigenous to primitive humans and serves as a digestive symbiont (not janitorial), taking our food and transforming it via its excretions into readily available nutrients at 50 times the rate of bacteria. I need this increased digestion to rapidly heal and help build my nervous system and glandular system which is currently suffering tremendously. This is not a "theory", trichinosis is supposed to be living in symbiosis with me. I fully expect that 10 days from now I will be reaping tremendous benefits. Does it make sense that we can eat high meat but parasites are still bad? Give me a break, the germ theory is not just bunk in regards to bacteria. It is bunk period.

Then again, I might be too toxic to form symbiosis. But I am not worried about getting upset stomach and diarrhea from it. The very notion is hilarious. Been there, done that.

Its been more than 2 weeks, how did your experiment go? Did you reap tremendous benefits?