A day in the life of TylerDurden

[PaleoPhil]

Not me, I just props me meat on some hunks o' dry suet and turns it. Or ye can use a drying rack, like dis 'ere 'n:



Thar ye be laddies! A more fit use fer cookie racks.

String or rope will also work, and you can probably use tallow to hold ground meat together if you like, but hooks (with solid cuts of meat) are probably best, yes.

[Ioanna]

I wish I lived near you

well, you're still welcome anytime!

Should post a photo of our fridges.
 

lol

[RawZi]

How would i go about air drying ground meat? I don't see how ground meat can be hanged.

    http://www.adventuresinrawfood.com/tips-for-handling-and-storage-of-teflex-sheets

    I've never used it for meat though.

[Furion]

Hey Tyler,

Can you outline the foods you were eating when you were experimenting with a raw zero carb diet?

thanks.

[TylerDurden]

Hey Tyler,

Can you outline the foods you were eating when you were experimenting with a raw zero carb diet?

thanks.

  Raw marrow, raw suet, in 1 trial I had some heated suet, also raw tongue(all grassfed or wild re the meats/organs) plus usual standard raw  organic grassfed beef muscle-meat or raw wild game such as raw wild mallard duck or raw wild hare carcasses. I had a little raw oysters and raw turkey breast fillets in 1 trial but only for a very short period as I was scared of the rabbit-starvation issue. Basically I usually had a supply of raw fat available such as raw marrow with my raw meats and the raw meats were relatively fatty in themselves.  Dead boring re variety but it was meant to fit in with Stefansson`s claimed fat percentages etc.

[PaleoPhil]

I learned one thing at another forum that might help explain your symptoms that seemed related to Mg deficiency, Tyler. Apparently, some ZCers reported temporary Mg deficiencies, resulting in symptoms like muscle tetany, but they stuck with it and they resolved. One added in a little bit of greens, organs and seafood to her diet and still eats small amounts of plant foods. If you had a deficiency, then it sounds like it was too severe to stick with it without significantly modifying your diet. You're still eating low enough carbs not to have to be concerned about it much anyway. Even Dr. Harris of PaNu, who eats a basically carnivorous diet, doesn't think your reported carb levels are too high (he has called anything up to around 25% carbs OK--and that is your reported approximate max as well).

[TylerDurden]

Adding in extra magnesium via raw foods(eg raw oysters) certainly did nothing for me at the time. I was also eating some raw organs such as raw kidney and raw liver  here and there though I made sure to eat them along with raw marrow and raw suet, so even with a magnesium-deficiency, I should have compensated for it easily with all those foods. And, of course, there`s no chance that I was magnesium-deficient prior to trying those RZC trials given that I was consuming greater amounts of raw oysters etc. than in the trials, and had no related  symptoms, beforehand. Still, in a way it`s  a good theory as it would explain why my teeth deteriorated so suddenly after  a couple of weeks or so.  I don`t think I want to experiment with massive artificial doses of magnesium supplements, though, as I doubt all the negative symptoms I had were from magnesium-deficiency.

As for Dr Harris, I view him as having no more than c.25% of the credibility that Aajonus has, and I view AV as a partial crook as it is. I dont buy the 25% figure for carbs as I know some Instinctos who do very well healthwise on high(paleo) carbs. Plus it was mentioned to me by 1 or 2 people in the US who visited raw gatherings frequently that the high carb Instinctos looked much healthier/biologically younger than Primal Dieters of the same age. So much for the Stefanssonian notion that any and all animal protein is 100% healthy. It seems the dairy-free nature of the high carb Instinctos`diets was what did the trick.

My main reasons for avoiding high carb are that I don`t like the large frequent stools and am not interested in the bigger appetites I get when eating lots of raw carbs, plus it saves me money. But there are always situations here and there where some farms I deal with go out of business or change markets etc. etc. where I am sometimes forced to eat mostly just raw fruits for  2 weeks , and that doesnt bother me at all.

[PaleoPhil]

...As for Dr Harris, I view him as having no more than c.25% of the credibility that Aajonus has, and I view AV as a partial crook as it is.

I don't want to argue about it, so I'll just dissasociate myself from this comment, as I don't think it's productive. I know you disagree, so we'll have to agree to disagree on this.

I dont buy the 25% figure for carbs as I know some Instinctos who do very well healthwise on high(paleo) carbs.

I wasn't arguing that you or anyone else couldn't handle more carbs than that. What I meant was, your level of carb intake is not high enough to warrant much concern about potential side effects. I only cited Dr. Harris to illustrate that narrow point, not because I expect you to agree with his broader views.

[KD]

My main reasons for avoiding high carb are that I don`t like the large frequent stools and am not interested in the bigger appetites I get when eating lots of raw carbs, plus it saves me money. But there are always situations here and there where some farms I deal with go out of business or change markets etc. etc. where I am sometimes forced to eat mostly just raw fruits for  2 weeks , and that doesnt bother me at all.

What kind of fruits do you eat, say in Winter/Spring?

[PaleoPhil]

I found that my dehydrator rack works nicely for storing my air-drying meats. No need to use fancy ground beef extruders, I just separate ground beef into chunks with a knife and lay them on the racks and either rotate them once the tops are dried, or dry the entire outsides in one go by turning on the dehydrator for a couple hours.

[wodgina]

My main reasons for avoiding high carb are that I don`t like the large frequent stools and am not interested in the bigger appetites I get when eating lots of raw carbs, plus it saves me money. But there are always situations here and there where some farms I deal with go out of business or change markets etc. etc. where I am sometimes forced to eat mostly just raw fruits for  2 weeks , and that doesnt bother me at all.

Closet fruitarian? 

[goodsamaritan]

whoa, 2 weeks of fruitarian?

Anything more than a day of fruitarian bothers me.

If I'm over proteinized I can do a 3 day fruit / fatty fruit fast.

More than that really would bother me.

[TylerDurden]

What kind of fruits do you eat, say in Winter/Spring?

  I just eat what`s available. When in Italy, I`ll eat things like watermelon, here in the UK it`s mostly berries like blueberries or tangerines.

[TylerDurden]

Closet fruitarian? 

  I don`t always have a choice but to eat raw fruits. Farmers every now and then go out of business or suddenly refuse to sell outside their local area or severe weather might prevent many  farmers from turning up at my farmers`market, so then I have a choice of either eating truly revolting low grade grainfed meat from some seriously dodgy butchers in my area or eating cooked junk food or eating raw fruits. Actually, since markets are usually held weekly, a week on fruits is more usual than 2 weeks.   I wouldn`t do well of course if I went 3 weeks plus on fruitarian diets, but that situation doesn`t ever occur, of course.

[TylerDurden]

Couple of admissions:-  1)  The only negative thing I've had, long-term, since recovering on an RPD diet, is the fact that as soon as I wake up, if I stay in bed for another 10+ minutes, my back becomes very stiff and aching. Wasn't generally an issue pre-RPD diet, but perhaps my weaker skeletal structure in those days was somehow a benefit in this particular case. Moving down and sleeping on the floor minus a pillow doesn't solve the problem, I usually need a warm bath or just walk around  for a bit to get rid of this ache.

Now the above condition isn't, of course, a problem if I just get up immediately and don't ever go in for lie-ins any more, and anyway I don't really need lie-ins on this diet, ever since I got rid of my dairy-related chronic fatigue years ago. It can be awkward, though, if there are others around who are not early-risers as I tend to automatically wake up at first light if I'm in a room with plenty of access to sunlight(and if I  go to sleep before 1am).

2) re mistaken feelings of invulnerability:- because doctors in the past were utterly useless in diagnosing, let alone healing, my previous health-problems, I swore over a decade ago, never to see another doctor again. When I did this RPD diet and healed in so remarkable a fashion(I'd originally assumed some conditions I had were incurable at the time), I never got into a situation where I even needed a doctor, so I didn't care until now.... 1 lousy , incompetent skier  skied into me and put an end to that. What I mean is that doctors can be useful in cases like car-crashes or similiar accidents re emergency operations, so we shouldn't attack them all the time.  Though, when I just recently registered with a doctor for the first time in 15+ years I almost sighed when I  was asked whether I was eating a healthy diet or not; I felt almost tempted to say "yes, I am on a very healthy diet, I eat raw meat  plus "high-meat"!" etc.

[cherimoya_kid]

Though, when I just recently registered with a doctor for the first time in 15+ years I almost sighed when I  was asked whether I was eating a healthy diet or not; I felt almost tempted to say "yes, I am on a very healthy diet, I eat raw meat  plus "high-meat"!" etc.

LOL I know what you mean. 

[goodsamaritan]

E.R. docs are fine.
That is one part of that profession that they do well.
And only that.

[TylerDurden]

I had an unusual experience when buying a few raw meats today at my local farmers' market.  I went to a wild venison stall and asked the girl if I might order some unusual raw organs at a later date such as raw tongue or raw marrow. She immediately mentioned that someone I probably knew/friend etc. had already made orders for such raw organs, even raw testicles(which I find too weird to eat, IMO). Anyway, given that virtually no one else ever asks for raw organs, she immediately sussed that I was a raw-meat-eater, despite my initial vague claim to be doing merely a "palaeolithic diet".

I'd already met 1 other RPDer at the market, and I suspect this is quite another RPDer. Anyway, it does seem as though the RPD/raw-meat-eating  community is steadily growing, and not just in the USA, as some years ago, I was  virtually certain that I was the only RPDer for many miles around. It's a good thing, in a way. I mean it probably makes it more difficult for a short while to get enough quality raw animal foods, such as raw organs, but at the same time, by creating a target clientele, it makes farmers who, previously, would have simply thrown away most such raw organs, suddenly realise there are some wacky people out there willing to pay a reasonable price for such things as raw heart, raw suet etc, and then we may even get farms who sell mainly to RPDers etc. I've seen this in the US, where NorthStar Bison at one point had a Primal Diet self-label stating proudly that they routinely served Primal Dieters with quality raw meats. I fear AV got them to take it down for some weird reason(he likes to keep the PD logo/concept etc. to himself, apparently?)

[Hans89]

Testicles are tasty. Don't let the thought put you off.

[TylerDurden]

Testicles are tasty. Don't let the thought put you off.

I've tried stag testicles. They were rock-hard and would have taken ages to chew if I'd taken the bother of doing so. They also were somewhat aged and tasted too rank for me, even though I love some types of high-meat. Plus, on a psychological level, I'm just not comfortable eating animals' private parts; in the case of testicles/penis, it seems almost gay! I'd rather stick to basic meats/organs instead.

[Hans89]

I can assure you that I'm not gay... At first I had that aversion, but it went away pretty quickly. I've only eaten lamb testicles so far. The trick is to slice the skins, there are two layers. Inside there is very soft tissue.

[TylerDurden]

Raw junk foods:- when I'm unable to get high-quality raw animal foods, I compromise either by buying raw (often nonorganic) fruit or I buy what is more or less raw junk food. That is , I go to a local fishmonger's. Sometimes, they'll have good quality stuff such as raw wildcaught swordfish, if I'm lucky, but at other times, they provide me with raw prawns as I find the rest of their rather small selection to be fish with too many small bones or lacking taste or consisting of farmed salmon etc. The raw prawns are, IMO, raw junk food as I'm sure they are farmed, but it's better than eating cooked foods. I think(?) that farmed shellfish has higher standards than farmed fish re what the creatures are fed on, judging from reports, so it's not the end of the world - and I eat so much raw wild game that I'm not worried about more minor diversions from RPD diet, at times.

[TylerDurden]

I just paid a regular visit to my local farmers' market. Anyway,  I saw a new stall offering organic meats. I was , as usual, highly sceptical, but decided to ask how they raised their animals. Sure enough, I was told that the animals were fed on the highest quality organic grains(wheat etc.) which made groan inwardly . This is, unfortunately,  quite common. Those crooked farmers know they can make a better immediate profit if they stuff their animals on grain(and thereby fatten them up faster for slaughter), and they know that most of the public, however health-conscious, have no real clue about the better taste(and better health-benefits) of 100% grassfed meats. Plus, the public are easily conned by the organic status label which they foolishly accept as implying that the animals are all raised on healthy diets.

The most insidious are those farmers who boast that their animals are on grassfed diets but quietly forget to mention that their animals are fed on grains during the winter.

Of course, the farmers are fools as raising their animals on grains, however "organic" those grains might be, means they have to pay much higher costs re curing their animals from grains-derived illnesses.

Anyway, I naturally, bought raw meats from a reliable seller elsewhere in the market who has provided me with excellent-tasting meats in the past. His sheep/lamb are, apparently, raised on grass and stubble turnips, no grains.  The meats are not organic(merely "free-range") but are very cheap.

In a way, I'm lucky as the LFM markets, unlike most  other shops/markets, have strict rules so that it would be extremely unwise for farmers to lie to customers about what their animals are fed on. That said, I mainly rely on the taste of the meats, rather than a farmers' say-so or some official label like "organic".

There was some talk by the UK Soil Association of creating 5 different categories for the organic label, with the topmost category only being available for raw wild game , the 2nd rank being for 100%grassfed cattle(?) and the like, but it seems not to have gone ahead., unfortunately.

[PaleoPhil]

In a way, I'm lucky as the LFM markets, unlike most  other shops/markets, have strict rules so that it would be extremely unwise for farmers to lie to customers about what their animals are fed on. That said, I mainly rely on the taste of the meats, rather than a farmers' say-so or some official label like "organic".

Yeah, I've noticed that some meats sold in the healthfood market taste and look much better than the meats in the supermarkets, and even between the supermarket meats there are differences, with the cheapest supermarket having meats that look fattier and more unpleasant and don't taste as good. My guess is that the cheaper the meat, the more grains/soy/molasses/chicken feces/etc. they are fed. It seems that when it comes to meats you do generally get what you pay for.

I've noticed this with fats too. The suet (perinephric fat} labeled 100% grassfed tastes, looks and feels better than the suet and pork leaf fat labeled organic but not 100% grassfed, and the supermarket suet that doesn't have grassfed or organic labels is the worst of all.

[Hans89]

I've noticed this with fats too. The suet (perinephric fat} labeled 100% grassfed tastes, looks and feels better than the suet and pork leaf fat labeled organic but not 100% grassfed, and the supermarket suet that doesn't have grassfed or organic labels is the worst of all.

Wow... I've never been able to buy suet except on a special offer at the farmers market. And all of the suppliers save one are very unreliable. If it weren't for that one, I wouldn't be able to find any raw animal fat consistently. The hunter said the butcher doesn't give him the suet and they throw away the back fat when taking off the hide! I'd gladly have the grainfed organic stuff in the market if I could..