A day in the life of TylerDurden

[TylerDurden]

I just read that Jared Diamond has been accused of fraud, as of 2009, and  is being sued for 10 million dollars. I'm not surprised as there have been recurrent scientific scandals/frauds in the last 80 years or so within the field of anthropology, such as Margaret Mead's fraud re Samoa etc. I see that Diamond is a big fan of Freud, another famous fraud whose ideas were roundly debunked by Eysenck.

[Löwenherz]

Probably because there is some truth to it.

Definitely!

[PaleoPhil]

Rather ironic that Diamond is being sued by the widow of Stephen Jay Gould, another controversial scientist. Nassim Taleb has pointed out that social sciences in general are highly prone to error, bias, logical fallacies, etc.

[TylerDurden]

I am away for some weeks, won't be able to reply more often than once a week or so.

[TylerDurden]

I have recently been investigating the negative effects of cooked food on teeth re human evolution. The stuff debunks weston-price's notions somewhat. I will explain in another thread, tomorrow probably.

[cherimoya_kid]

The stuff debunks weston-price's notions somewhat.

Which part?  The fact that changes in diet caused tribes to go from almost no crooked teeth to terribly crooked teeth in one generation is indisputable.  It's caused by the narrowing of the jaw from lack of vitamin K-2 in the diet, as well as general under-development of the lower face, which is probably caused by lack of vitamin D in the diet.  Poor absorption/use of those two vitamins, plus poor calcium absorption/use, are probably also factors.

Debunk indeed.  Just because he's an American, and advocated cooked food, doesn't mean he didn't know about teeth.  The man was the first president of the American Dental Association.  He pioneered many of the techniques of modern dentistry.

I will readily grant that Dr. Price should have been far more clear about the health problems from cooked food and grains. I think he understood them.  I think, though, that he was afraid that people would consider a diet of raw meat/fish/organs plus some raw fruits to be extreme, and was hoping to first get people to at least eat as well as the traditional tribes. You have to admit, even accomplishing THAT would be a HUGE step toward better health.  The all-raw or nearly-all-raw part can come second.

I have no doubt he saw lots of meat and fish eaten raw in his travels.  You'll notice, though, that he never MENTIONS it.  There are only two possible reasons for that:

1.  He was too stupid to understand the importance of eating raw, or only very lightly-cooked

2. He was afraid that people would consider eating raw animals foods too extreme, and just wanted them to eat better quality, even if that meant hiding (by omission) the usefulness of the raw diet.

As smart as he was, I'm betting on the second option.  HEAVILY.

[TylerDurden]

I couldn't care less whether he was an american or not. What matters to me is that he revived the whole silly "noble savage" theory. Anyway, I'll mention all the data in the other thread. Not saying it cancels out all his utterings re teeth, just some of them.

[TylerDurden]

I recently checked the bite-pressure of dogs versus wolves and wolves out-perform dogs in this regard by a considerable amount. So dogs have weaker jaws than wolves. I recently re-checked some articles claiming that eating softer, cooked food led to the deterioration in size of the human jaw, thus increasing the number of dental problems, however, since dogs seem to  get weakened jaws due to bad genetics/human-led breeding rather than cooked foods since they have been eating raw until the last 9-12 decades(right?), it is similiarly possible that eating softer cooked foods did not lead to human dental problems and smaller jaws per se, but that the use of fire re warding off predators led to a lack of natural selection as a result, thus allowing more defective people with smaller jaws to breed.

[cherimoya_kid]

I recently checked the bite-pressure of dogs versus wolves and wolves out-perform dogs in this regard by a considerable amount. So dogs have weaker jaws than wolves. I recently re-checked some articles claiming that eating softer, cooked food led to the deterioration in size of the human jaw, thus increasing the number of dental problems, however, since dogs seem to  get weakened jaws due to bad genetics/human-led breeding rather than cooked foods since they have been eating raw until the last 9-12 decades(right?), it is similiarly possible that eating softer cooked foods did not lead to human dental problems and smaller jaws per se, but that the use of fire re warding off predators led to a lack of natural selection as a result, thus allowing more defective people with smaller jaws to breed.

I don't think that humans fought with their teeth all that much.  I imagine we used weapons well before we started using fire, even if it was just rocks and sticks. I could be wrong.

As far as dogs, does your research allow for differences in body size between dogs and wolves?

I would also say that some dog species probably have far stronger bites than wolves, like pit bulls and especially Rottweilers.

[Dorothy]

I somewhere was exposed to the thesis that it was a genetic mutation of a smaller jaw that allowed for our brain size to increase. The same gene difference is in muscular dystrophy (if I remember right) also creates a smaller weaker jaw. Great apes powerful jaws make larger brain capacity impossible supposedly.

Thought it was fascinating at the time and should have taken notes. I wonder if I can find where I learned of it. I'll try to search for it tomorrow. The idea that a genetic disease mutation made our brains able to get large......... talk about the power of diversity and mutations. It can be surprising what can lead to better adaptation.

[TylerDurden]

I don't think that humans fought with their teeth all that much.  I imagine we used weapons well before we started using fire, even if it was just rocks and sticks. I could be wrong.

As far as dogs, does your research allow for differences in body size between dogs and wolves?

I would also say that some dog species probably have far stronger bites than wolves, like pit bulls and especially Rottweilers.

  Body-size does matter a little bit, in that the bigger a dog is the stronger it will be than other members of his breed, but not necessarily stronger than other breeds.

A few websites claim that only pit-bulls have stronger bite-pressures than wolves, but the concensus seems to be that wolves have a far bigger bite-pressure than even pit-bulls, rottweilers etc. Indeed, there is even a website which claims that the claims re pit-bulls bite-pressure are woefully exaggerated.

I don't think that fighting with teeth was the main issue. The idea is that teeth deteriorated due to congenital conditions becoming more common after natural selection vanished with the advent of fire, used for warding off predators.

[Dorothy]

Found something re: gene mutation that caused smaller jaw and led to larger brain.

http://www.uphs.upenn.edu/news/News_Releases/march04/myosinmutant.html

There's a bunch out there on the subject but I don't have the time atm to look into it further. But it's an interesting hypothesis.

I remember now that I saw an interview with the scientist that was looking for the gene that caused his brother's muscular dystrophy and found the gene linked to MD - the thing was - that it also was the same gene that was linked to a difference between us and apes and when that gene is "normal", like the apes, our jaws would be too big to allow for our brain development.

[TylerDurden]

While I'm all in favour of bacteria, I still had one minor phobia left. That is, until recently, if I dropped some portion of food I was eating in the street, I would refuse to pick it up and eat it afterwards. Just today, I found I was easily able to do so, after all.

[TylerDurden]

I have come across a friend of a friend who has had Lyme Disease for 4 or 5 years. I have been indirectly asked by a friend of his to give my verdict on a cooked-palaeodiet. I am curious to know if anyone has ever healed themselves from Lyme Disease on a RVAF diet?

[TylerDurden]

I have been asked to do a review of a Kurt Harris essay:-

http://www.archevore.com/panu-weblog/2011/3/30/paleo-20-a-diet-manifesto.html

It has to be one of the most wrongheaded posts I have ever read. So many "facts" cited which turn out to be based on wholly false information etc. Painful to read.

[cherimoya_kid]

I have come across a friend of a friend who has had Lyme Disease for 4 or 5 years. I have been indirectly asked by a friend of his to give my verdict on a cooked-palaeodiet. I am curious to know if anyone has ever healed themselves from Lyme Disease on a RVAF diet?

I knew a guy from the rawfoods.com forums who did.  He was not getting better on a vegan diet, but he started adding raw egg yolks, and saw tremendous improvement.  That was about 10 years ago.

[Fermenter Zym]

I have come across a friend of a friend who has had Lyme Disease for 4 or 5 years. I have been indirectly asked by a friend of his to give my verdict on a cooked-palaeodiet. I am curious to know if anyone has ever healed themselves from Lyme Disease on a RVAF diet?

I have Chronic Lyme and Coinfections and have recently started to eat RVAF again. We'll see how I'm doing in a couple weeks to a couple months and see if we can answer that.

I know that Dr. Ron of the Weston Price Foundation has Lyme and also eats raw. He said he has almost no symptoms now because of his nutritionally dense raw diet. http://www.drrons.com/diet-chronic-disease-and-optimal-health-4.htm

[Löwenherz]

..I know that Dr. Ron of the Weston Price Foundation has Lyme and also eats raw. He said he has almost no symptoms now because of his nutritionally dense raw diet. http://www.drrons.com/diet-chronic-disease-and-optimal-health-4.htm

According to wikipedia only 25 - 50 % of all infected people show symptoms.

I guess that Lyme is not a disease at all (hope this doesn't sound arrogant) but something completely normal for us and only problematic like so many other "dis-eases" if we live on cooked starches and other junk.

Löwenherz

[PaleoPhil]

That's basically what Dr. Ron says at that link.

Here's another Lyme disease success story:

Real Life Testimonial: Ben’s recovery from Lyme disease
Posted by Amber Karnes on Feb 7, 2011 in Real Life Testimonials
http://robbwolf.com/2011/02/07/real-life-testimonial-bens-recovery-from-lyme-disease/

[Fermenter Zym]

That's basically what Dr. Ron says at that link.

Here's another Lyme disease success story:

Real Life Testimonial: Ben’s recovery from Lyme disease
Posted by Amber Karnes on Feb 7, 2011 in Real Life Testimonials
http://robbwolf.com/2011/02/07/real-life-testimonial-bens-recovery-from-lyme-disease/

Does he eat raw paleo?

[PaleoPhil]

I doubt it. Probably more like the WAPF, which does admittedly advocate some raw animal foods.

[TylerDurden]

Dr Ron is a fan of the WAPF and has written articles about that diet.


The last time I bought some raw wild game, I had one of the butchers ask me how I cooked the meats, as they occasionally do. I rarely have the guts to state that I eat it raw, so I just stand there, usually, quite speechless. The trouble is that if I'm honest, then that just causes more problems.

[djr_81]

Dr Ron is a fan of the WAPF and has written articles about that diet.


The last time I bought some raw wild game, I had one of the butchers ask me how I cooked the meats, as they occasionally do. I rarely have the guts to state that I eat it raw, so I just stand there, usually, quite speechless. The trouble is that if I'm honest, then that just causes more problems.

Tell him you eat it plain without much preparation; you like the flavor of the game to come through without adulteration. No lies yet you don't have to worry about telling them you eat it raw.

[Iguana]

The trouble is that if I'm honest, then that just causes more problems.

What kind of problems ? You're a customer and you're free to do what you want!

I don't buy meat from butchers, but I wouldn't be afraid to tell them as I tell other people if they ask. They can think what they want, I don't care and I guess they feel it because I've never got any aggressive reaction. 

[TylerDurden]

The trouble is that , sometimes, some sellers are very limited and feel that they are "doing me a favour" by pretending to not have the kind of meats I want. The phobias about raw meats are quite extensive in society, still.