Bodybuilder/Model going Paleo for longevity benefits

[Brother]

I think it would be a good idea to do a piece on RVAF diet  bodybuilders on rawpaleodiet.com. Randy Roach's article would be ideal, but anyone with more info would be welcome:-

http://www.westonaprice.org/mens-health/252-splendid-specimens.html

Well thank you kindly for providing the link  

Many of these guys like Tanny were inspirations. They may not have been all 100% raw, but their ideas on nutrition were groundbreaking.

[KD]

...bro


http://www.davedraper.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/20591/
(comment on the article: "These dangerous raw foods didn't appear to harm him...he passed away at 90.") lulz...

that might be alot of proof within one person, but I was speaking mostly about other people here one might share experiences with, not to mention you can find a bodybuilder/actor/athlete that can rationalize any diet approach, so these do not proooove that something is healthy or safe unfortunately. Finding an excuse as to why some practices are unhealthy despite others success seems to be easy as dehydrated pie for most folks anyway. This much I have learned

There are some past pioneers, but largely its about undergoing your own unknown investigation.

[B.Money]

I read that as "ten sets of ten repetitions". I think that sounds like total overkill. With a very low weight as part of loosing fat, sure, makes sense,  but for mass?. No. Pointless at best.

yes, in the second link you posted it mentioned a 10x10 workout. There's another 10x10 setup also called "German volume" I hear a lot of people rave about over on bodybuilding.com. I was just wondering if you have ever had any success with that type of routine or if that's sort of what you follow since it was included in the link.

[Brother]

yes, in the second link you posted it mentioned a 10x10 workout. There's another 10x10 setup also called "German volume" I hear a lot of people rave about over on bodybuilding.com. I was just wondering if you have ever had any success with that type of routine or if that's sort of what you follow since it was included in the link.

I never used such a routine, because I never found it neccesery to load the muscles like that for results. Anything beyond 3x12 and such is just a waste of my time. I sometimes moves between excersizes without any break at all. Would probably qualify as something similar. But to put that much load on a single muscle at a time seems counterproductive. Many bodybuilders think that muscleburn means they had a good workout, so they overdo everything.

[djr_81]

I never used such a routine, because I never found it neccesery to load the muscles like that for results. Anything beyond 3x12 and such is just a waste of my time. I sometimes moves between excersizes without any break at all. Would probably qualify as something similar. But to put that much load on a single muscle at a time seems counterproductive. Many bodybuilders think that muscleburn means they had a good workout, so they overdo everything.

I'm not sure exactly what the intent is with a 10x10 workout but perhaps they step back on intensity a bit and step up the sets to incur greater muscle fatigue. Lots of schools of thought out there as to the best ways to work the muscles.

[Brother]

I'm not sure exactly what the intent is with a 10x10 workout but perhaps they step back on intensity a bit and step up the sets to incur greater muscle fatigue. Lots of schools of thought out there as to the best ways to work the muscles.

in the Gym, everybody is an expert and everybody has the one size fit all solution that never fails. As I said, I can see it's value in the right context. If Vince said it, he had a good reason I am sure. I did not read the articles, I just did a google search for him, I have a lot of trust in his legacy and ideas. But since you asked for my opinion, I don't fully understand why he would choose so many reps over more volume and less reps (going by the HIT principles). I also have a liking for slow systems. They are frowned upon by many, but I think it is a load of crap because those that actually use them (and doesnt just read about how ineffective they are in articles written by people with competing systems to sell) get good results with a small investment of time. I have the utmost respect for Joshua Trentine. I have never met the guy, but he is a RAF pro bodybuilder and he uses a system called overload. Which I would love to get into, but since he is developing it himself (from what I understand) and it requires special equipment (also self developed) there arent a lot of places where you can try it out besides his own Gym?! =/

[RawZi]

As for raw chicken, I don't like the taste of raw chicken.

But RawZi likes raw chicken.

    Only chicken raised on bugs and grass, I don't like it when it's corn/soy fed.  Then it tastes reminiscent of wax and rancid to me.  I love that pasture grazed or free range, but not raw ceviche "cooked".  On PD it's recommended to eat chicken ceviche in the beginning, to get used to raw meat.  I get dull aches from the chicken prepared in those PD recipes.  I do like raw chicken.  To me it tastes like chicken I ate in childhood, especially when I'm eating chicken high-meat.  I know the chicken I ate as a kid was not fermented, but I just hadn't eaten chicken in so many years, so maybe my perception is easily deceiving me there.

[B.Money]

Haha that is true everyone's an expert in their own minds. One thing I have learned though (at least in strength training, but I am sure applies to the bodybuilders also) is that there are many, many ways to get the job done. Seems the success stories revolve around consistency and hard work.

You guys should post up some progress logs of some sort (it would be cool to see what other RP dieters are doing)--if there were more lifting orientated logs I might decide to copy and paste mine from another forum.

[MelissaF]

Hello and Welcome to this forum.
My tip is not to change your diet too drastically.But If you intend to change it then make sure you change it over a decent period of time. Makes the transition easier. I say this because you rely on your body for income. Sudden changes may alter your physique (weight changes) etc. So it's best done gradually.
Regards,
Ali.

[Brother]

Seems the success stories revolve around consistency and hard work.

And proper nutrition 

You guys should post up some progress logs of some sort (it would be cool to see what other RP dieters are doing)--if there were more lifting orientated logs I might decide to copy and paste mine from another forum.

You should do so anyway. It would be interesting to follow the progress of a strengh athlete on this diet.

[leadahead]

Well, one thing re rawpalaeodiets I have noticed is that they help lose weight much better than other diets and help build muscle quicker(though only with exercise of course).

I totally agree with this!

If only the producers of "The Biggest Loser" would know this fact then they would find it easy to manage their  over weights. Peace!

[ForTheHunt]

Well, one thing re rawpalaeodiets I have noticed is that they help lose weight much better than other diets and help build muscle quicker(though only with exercise of course).

I'm not really sure I agree with that yet. I had massive trouble gaining muscle mass on RPD. It wasn't until I went primal and started adding loads of dairy into my diet as well as honey till I started gaining any sensible amount of weight again.

[TylerDurden]

I'm not really sure I agree with that yet. I had massive trouble gaining muscle mass on RPD. It wasn't until I went primal and started adding loads of dairy into my diet as well as honey till I started gaining any sensible amount of weight again.

  Well, I agree that the minority here who were underweight pre-RPD diet do seem to have problems re gaining weight on a rawpalaeodiet minus raw dairy, but the others generally find they reach a normal weight and build muscle faster than on a SAD diet, provided they do the usual relevant exercises as before, of course.

Interesting anecdote:- Schwarzenegger in his autobiography said that the canteen food he had in the Austrian Army was so overcooked that he was forced to eat twice as much cooked meat as normal in order to maintain his huge bulk, and then he had to do twice as much exercise in order to get rid of the resulting extra fat.

[ForTheHunt]

  Well, I agree that the minority here who were underweight pre-RPD diet do seem to have problems re gaining weight on a rawpalaeodiet minus raw dairy, but the others generally find they reach a normal weight and build muscle faster than on a SAD diet, provided they do the usual relevant exercises as before, of course.

Interesting anecdote:- Schwarzenegger in his autobiography said that the canteen food he had in the Austrian Army was so overcooked that he was forced to eat twice as much cooked meat as normal in order to maintain his huge bulk, and then he had to do twice as much exercise in order to get rid of the resulting extra fat.

That is indeed very interesting. Got a source on that? Would love to read some more.

[TylerDurden]

That is indeed very interesting. Got a source on that? Would love to read some more.

I cannot remember which page S. wrote that in his autobiography, but it rings true given my own experience.

[kurite]

I'm not really sure I agree with that yet. I had massive trouble gaining muscle mass on RPD. It wasn't until I went primal and started adding loads of dairy into my diet as well as honey till I started gaining any sensible amount of weight again.

Is it possible you weren't eating enough and the milk just helped get in the calories? Also is your avatar a picture of you?

[ForTheHunt]

Is it possible you weren't eating enough and the milk just helped get in the calories? Also is your avatar a picture of you?

I was eating plenty of calories, in fact I'm pretty sure I was over eating. And yep.

[kurite]

I was eating plenty of calories, in fact I'm pretty sure I was over eating. And yep.

Thats amazing! Were you even close to as toned and big as you are back when you were on a SAD? What does your routine look like???

[ForTheHunt]

Thats amazing! Were you even close to as toned and big as you are back when you were on a SAD? What does your routine look like???

The picture is taken when I was on cooked. Although granted, very healthy cooked.

My routine varies a lot. Right now lots of HIIT and high intensity crossfitness exercises. (compound lifts and bodyweight training). The lighting in that pic is very generous though, just so you know ;>

[kurite]

Unless you photoshopped it you can only get a picture make you look better to a certain point. What were your results when you went raw paleo/primal?

[ForTheHunt]

Unless you photoshopped it you can only get a picture make you look better to a certain point. What were your results when you went raw paleo/primal?

Nono, no photoshop.

Uhm, RPD not that great. Had no trouble gaining fat due to eating a loot of fat. Muscle was sort of lagging behind, my guess is that fat isn't protein sparing enough and the carbs from fruit just didn't cut it, although I don't know ^^.

I'm gaining weight pretty fast now on Primal, with timed milkshakes with honey after workouts and then plenty of milk meat and fat. I really like it. I know it's not optimal for bodybuilding but I think it's the closest thing in the paleo spectrum.

[kurite]

Nono, no photoshop.

Uhm, RPD not that great. Had no trouble gaining fat due to eating a loot of fat. Muscle was sort of lagging behind, my guess is that fat isn't protein sparing enough and the carbs from fruit just didn't cut it, although I don't know ^^.

I'm gaining weight pretty fast now on Primal, with timed milkshakes with honey after workouts and then plenty of milk meat and fat. I really like it. I know it's not optimal for bodybuilding but I think it's the closest thing in the paleo spectrum.

Hmm. Thats rather dissapointing and suprising. I would think its easy to get lean on this diet and then just get your cals up and gain lots of muscle. Did you eat a lot of fruit? I personally believe to gain lots of muscle you need at least 250g of carbs a day.

[ForTheHunt]

Hmm. Thats rather dissapointing and suprising. I would think its easy to get lean on this diet and then just get your cals up and gain lots of muscle. Did you eat a lot of fruit? I personally believe to gain lots of muscle you need at least 250g of carbs a day.

I definitely wasn't eating 250g. Probably more near 100-150g. Although according to the research I've read, the muscle sparing effect of carbs and fat together is similar to if you'd carbs and protein only.

So for example if I ate 100g of carbs and 150g of fat it'd have the same results as 250g of carbs,

I'm not quite sure where I went wrong on the RPD though. Just felt like I couldn't get enough macronutrients in, or they just didn't work very well together. I ate a lot of fat and I just felt really gross, got fat really fast and then I got some ugly eczema on my neck which I've yet to get rid of.

If I had to guess, then I'd say where I went wrong was eating too much fat. The whole thing just never felt right really, fruit although great, just somehow didn't fit into the equation I think. I feel on primal everything fits perfectly together and I feel smashing.

[kurite]

I definitely wasn't eating 250g. Probably more near 100-150g. Although according to the research I've read, the muscle sparing effect of carbs and fat together is similar to if you'd carbs and protein only.

So for example if I ate 100g of carbs and 150g of fat it'd have the same results as 250g of carbs,

I'm not quite sure where I went wrong on the RPD though. Just felt like I couldn't get enough macronutrients in, or they just didn't work very well together. I ate a lot of fat and I just felt really gross, got fat really fast and then I got some ugly eczema on my neck which I've yet to get rid of.

If I had to guess, then I'd say where I went wrong was eating too much fat. The whole thing just never felt right really, fruit although great, just somehow didn't fit into the equation I think. I feel on primal everything fits perfectly together and I feel smashing.

Well I would always follow results over philosophy any day. Its odd that you got eczema from the paleo diet because mine has disappeared. How much fat were you eating exactly? And I totally agree that mixing any form of fruit and meat just doesn't feel right. I never combine any meat with fruit. If I do eat meat I wait 3-4 hours before eating fruit. I don't know if you want to try a water fast but eczema usually means your body is detoxing something. Have you been tested for allergies? You could also try mono days if your interested. One day only fruits the next only meat, organs and fat. Just an idea. What do you mean by you were missing macro nutrients?

[Brother]

I know it's not optimal for bodybuilding but I think it's the closest thing in the paleo spectrum.

wot? It is marvelous food. Nice idea with the honey milkshake, consider it stolen. I usually down an egg or two after work out, and some berries before if i am low on energy for some reason. This is a really good idea you got

personally believe to gain lots of muscle you need at least 250g of carbs a day

Based on what exactly? http://www.myspace.com/joshuatrentine <-ZC RAF pro bodybuilder.