Author Topic: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?  (Read 29149 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline King Salmon

  • Elder
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
  • Gender: Male
  • Eating the best realistic diet
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #25 on: February 07, 2011, 01:40:41 pm »
Not true. I was lactose intolerant to pasteurized milk for the reasons stated in "The Untold Story Of Milk". However raw dairy is not a problem.

Nice try.I'm not buying it.You can't make a blanket statement that raw milk is not a problem for every lactose intolerant person on the planet.Glad it's not a problem for you.I stand by what I said:It's unnecessary.You can get better nutrition from other sources.Raw meat is a far superior food for adults.Talking about cars and modern conveniences is irrelevant.

Bottomline:Milk is for babies,meat is for adults.
"Eat the best of what's available and call it a day"

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #26 on: February 07, 2011, 01:50:03 pm »
I don't care, the babies can share.

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2011, 06:08:33 pm »
if tyler durden quotes a study about a1 versus a2 dairy, the study was done with pasteurised dairy !!

he forgot to mention that
  Granted,  studies are mostly done on pasteurised dairy which is what most people eat, but there are many aspects of dairy that do not change significantly via heat such as the excess hormones in dairy , the excess calcium etc. And, yes, I do agree with KS that the main draw with raw dairy is that it is reminiscent of those days when they used to be breastfed or suckle on the teats of infant formula bottles.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2011, 07:09:31 am by TylerDurden »
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline ForTheHunt

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 560
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2011, 06:30:58 pm »
Nice try.I'm not buying it.You can't make a blanket statement that raw milk is not a problem for every lactose intolerant person on the planet.Glad it's not a problem for you.I stand by what I said:It's unnecessary.You can get better nutrition from other sources.Raw meat is a far superior food for adults.Talking about cars and modern conveniences is irrelevant.

Bottomline:Milk is for babies,meat is for adults.

Wow-eeeeee. That´s a lot of statements. Only a true fool can make such ridiculous generalizations.
Take everyones advice with a grain of salt. Try things out for your self and then make up your mind.

Offline RawZi

  • Mammoth Hunter
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,052
  • Gender: Female
  • Need I say more?
    • View Profile
    • my twitter
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2011, 01:34:32 am »
Bottomline:Milk is for babies,meat is for adults.

    If there's no one to breastfeed a baby, they can eat chewed up raw meat.  Supposedly a pediatrician said that one "The Bear Says" or something.  I know only know of people who've had success too in giving babies ground raw meat.  

I don't care, the babies can share.

    We can too.  Babies don't have fully digested pancreases, so one of the only adult foods they can eat is that.

    I think one of the bigger things is that in the same meal meat and milk interfere with each others digestion.  Another is that milk is supposed to be drank from a live flesh teat. If not, either don't do it, or find ways to do it similarly enough.

    So, milk IS bad for those that drink fast.
"Genuine truth angers people in general because they don't know what to do with the energy generated by a glimpse of reality." Greg W. Goodwin

Offline raw-al

  • Mammoth Hunter
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,961
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2011, 03:09:44 am »
      I think one of the bigger things is that in the same meal meat and milk interfere with each others digestion.  Another is that milk is supposed to be drank from a live flesh teat. If not, either don't do it, or find ways to do it similarly enough.

    So, milk IS bad for those that drink fast.
Ayurveda says not to mix milk with meat or veges or salt or fruit. It's basically somewhat a monomeal. It's OK to have it with sweet tastes.
Once it has fermented into yogurt etc that rule goes out the window.
Someone told me it is bad news to have with fish. Something to do with proteins fighting with each other.

As far as the live teat, that would be fun but a wee bit impractical. LOL but.... you are right, cold and fast is bad with milk even with strong digestion like mine. You can improve your luck with different spices but this will start a finger fight on this site... ;D ;D ;D
Cheers
Al

Offline King Salmon

  • Elder
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
  • Gender: Male
  • Eating the best realistic diet
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2011, 08:29:01 am »
Wow-eeeeee. That´s a lot of statements. Only a true fool can make such ridiculous generalizations.

Sorry,I'm not going to stoop to your low-level of name calling.I have more integrity than that.Hopefully a responsible moderator will deal with your nonsense.
"Eat the best of what's available and call it a day"

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2011, 08:39:32 am »
Sorry,I'm not going to stoop to your low-level of name calling.I have more integrity than that.Hopefully a responsible moderator will deal with your nonsense.

But you will stoop to sweeping generalizations. Only a fool could think in such black and white.

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #33 on: February 08, 2011, 08:43:17 am »
...and expect to see moderators come to the rescue when called out.

btw didn't you just call all of us dairy consumers "babies"

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2011, 08:54:44 am »
But you will stoop to sweeping generalizations. Only a fool could think in such black and white.
No, only a sensible fellow would be able to draw a sharp, clear comparison between adult, human raw-dairy-drinkers and infants of wild animals who hadn't been weaned yet.

I love that word "wean"   ;D ;). I use it whenever possible whenever some long-term raw-dairy-advocate finally starts admitting that they are having health-problems with raw dairy.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2011, 09:00:01 am by TylerDurden »
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2011, 09:20:33 am »
Of course you would be the one to say that!  ;D
If I start to ween I will let you guys know, as for the time being....


Offline King Salmon

  • Elder
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
  • Gender: Male
  • Eating the best realistic diet
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #36 on: February 08, 2011, 11:18:55 am »
...and expect to see moderators come to the rescue when called out.

btw didn't you just call all of us dairy consumers "babies"

haha...called out? I don't think so.I know I'm right on this one.I don't care what you think,say,or do.
It just proves my point how child-like you are.Hanging on to dear life with your precious milk.

Btw,it's so easy to act tough on internet forums.If you were in front of me,bet you wouldn't try to act so tough....which is again so child-like and silly.Drink up before you start cryin'.
"Eat the best of what's available and call it a day"

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #37 on: February 08, 2011, 02:46:06 pm »
You called milk drinkers babies, then claimed not to stoop to name calling.
Hanging on to dear life... right....
No one is acting tough other than you "King".

Offline King Salmon

  • Elder
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
  • Gender: Male
  • Eating the best realistic diet
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2011, 04:36:54 pm »
It's all good.I stand by my original point: Meat is a superior food for adults compared to dairy.
I don't see what the big deal is.Feel free to disagree.This will be my last post on this.Moving on.
"Eat the best of what's available and call it a day"

Offline raw-al

  • Mammoth Hunter
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,961
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #39 on: February 09, 2011, 03:14:05 am »
This will be my last post on this.Moving on.

Is 'dat a promise or a threat......  ;D ;D
Cheers
Al

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2011, 05:33:57 am »
Is 'dat a promise or a threat......  ;D ;D
No, he's just exasperated with all those "born-again" addicted raw-dairy fanatics.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline Caveman

  • Bear Hunter
  • ****
  • Posts: 179
  • Gender: Male
  • Man of the cave
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2011, 05:39:50 am »
Oh, man. Some people apparently can be healthy on raw dairy and some people apparently can't. Obviously, the conflict here is between people who have had good experiences with it, versus people who have had bad experiences with it. People can also be "born-again" anti-raw dairy fanatics..

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #42 on: February 09, 2011, 05:54:00 am »
Oh, man. Some people apparently can be healthy on raw dairy and some people apparently can't. Obviously, the conflict here is between people who have had good experiences with it, versus people who have had bad experiences with it. People can also be "born-again" anti-raw dairy fanatics..
  Except that my own reaction against raw dairy is  based not so much on my own experiences, but on the vast number of cases where RVAFers claimed to be fine on raw dairy and then subsequently admitted that they were not "detoxing" but had serious issues with raw dairy.  Initially, I was prepared to accept the usual raw-dairy delusionists' notions that I was an incredibly rare anomaly/exception to the rule, until I came across too many negative reports from people who had previously fervently assured me that they did fine on raw dairy, and then admitted that they did badly on it.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2011, 06:02:26 am by TylerDurden »
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline raw-al

  • Mammoth Hunter
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,961
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #43 on: February 09, 2011, 06:43:29 am »
  Except that my own reaction against raw dairy is  based not so much on my own experiences, but on the vast number of cases where RVAFers claimed to be fine on raw dairy and then subsequently admitted that they were not "detoxing" but had serious issues with raw dairy.  Initially, I was prepared to accept the usual raw-dairy delusionists' notions that I was an incredibly rare anomaly/exception to the rule, until I came across too many negative reports from people who had previously fervently assured me that they did fine on raw dairy, and then admitted that they did badly on it.
Amazing, you still give the same implication that anybody who drinks milk is delusionary.

psst....  ;D I know he's going to answer with the same speech over again that he gives in other similar threads... tee hee.
Cheers
Al

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2011, 07:31:02 am »
Amazing, you still give the same implication that anybody who drinks milk is delusionary.

psst....  ;D I know he's going to answer with the same speech over again that he gives in other similar threads... tee hee.
Childish and stupid, of course,  as always.  I have always previously maintained that  it is possible for a minority to thrive on raw dairy.   The trouble is that  the pro-raw-dairy-advocates find it offensive that anyone can claim that they have issues with raw dairy, so that they automatically criticise anyone who damns raw dairy in any way!
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline laterade

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 857
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #45 on: February 09, 2011, 07:49:19 am »
The trouble is that  the pro-raw-dairy-advocates find it offensive that anyone can claim that they have issues with raw dairy, so that they automatically criticise anyone who damns raw dairy in any way!


The trouble is that  the (anti)-raw-dairy-advocates find it offensive that anyone can claim that they (do not) have issues with raw dairy, so that they automatically criticise anyone who (does not) damn raw dairy in any way!

LOL Right back at ya.  ;)

Offline raw-al

  • Mammoth Hunter
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,961
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #46 on: February 09, 2011, 07:56:14 am »

The trouble is that  the (anti)-raw-dairy-advocates find it offensive that anyone can claim that they (do not) have issues with raw dairy, so that they automatically criticise anyone who (does not) damn raw dairy in any way!

LOL Right back at ya.  ;)
And then there's the anti-pro-raw-dairy-advocates.....  ;D who can't not agree also. LOL
Cheers
Al

Offline pioneer

  • Chief
  • *****
  • Posts: 612
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #47 on: February 10, 2011, 05:48:01 am »
The most logical argument is obviously the fact that all mammals are to be weaned off dairy by a few years of age. Logically, human adults are not meant to drink milk, it is food for babies. The calcium scam is a myth as well. Physiology and biomechanics tell us that weight bearing exercise trumps calcium, and besides the logic stands to reason that if an adult lion (or any adult mammal) does not need calcium, why should we? How do any carnivorous animals get calcium for that matter? How do dogs? Cats? Hawks? Bears?

Dissenents of this logic would say that carnivores get calcium from bones, but does anybody really know if that is in fact true? How many mg of calcium does a dog get from the average bone gnawing? How do pacific islanders in tribes get their calcium without milk I wonder? LOL

When russian astronauts went into space for the first time, they suffered extreme osteoporosis and calcium supplementation did JACK squat for restoring bone health. Weight bearing strength training proved superior when it reversed their osteoporosis.

I am getting off point here, the argument still stands whether milk is healthy or not, and I must say, whether it is healthy or not, the logic just is not there. Natural selection and micro adaptations in human evolution allowed vikings and northern europeans to adopt dairy when meat may have been scarce. Those who had severe problems with meat died off, those that did not lived, but that still does not mean milk should be in the human diet. All it means is that milk kept us alive in a time where meat could not have provided us with enough calories.

Finally, anyone following a true paleo diet does not drink milk. Milk is a product of domestication. Laziness, grains, soy, and all the other crap that followed were products of domestication as well. To put this all into perspective, those that want to practice a REAL paleo diet need to throw the milk in the garbage and start eating like a hunter gatherer.

I was once a believer of raw milk myself, till I noticed that I was going on 6 months on the primal diet and still had acne all over my face and body. I gave up the milk and went full meat only paleo, and what do you know, 100% clear skin. I also feel that milk was giving me feminizing effects and now I am reversing those, like having a deeper voice, more chest hair/ facial hair growth, and a leaner build. I dont retain as much water anymore like I used to. I had a problem where I would hold so much water after a meal that I would be lean before dinner and bloated/ fat after.
"All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing" - Edmund Burke

"There is a lot of pressure to be sexualized but not to actually be sexual."
- women's health member

Offline ster546464@yahoo.co.uk

  • Deer Hunter
  • ***
  • Posts: 87
    • View Profile
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #48 on: February 11, 2011, 01:15:00 am »
  Granted,  studies are mostly done on pasteurised dairy which is what most people eat, but there are many aspects of dairy that do not change significantly via heat such as the excess hormones in dairy , the excess calcium etc. And, yes, I do agree with KS that the main draw with raw dairy is that it is reminiscent of those days when they used to be breastfed or suckle on the teats of infant formula bottles.

ok fair enough
you mentioned it changes the calcium magnesium ratio too much

yet this can be balanced by taking silica

and, does this apply to any calcium rich food ?

Offline TylerDurden

  • Global Moderator
  • Mammoth Hunter
  • *****
  • Posts: 17,016
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
    • Raw Paleolithic Diet
Re: Raw Milk, when its bad for you?
« Reply #49 on: February 11, 2011, 01:54:23 am »
ok fair enough
you mentioned it changes the calcium magnesium ratio too much

yet this can be balanced by taking silica

and, does this apply to any calcium rich food ?
Using artificial means such as silica or raw pumpkin seeds does not make raw dairy any less healthy, it's just a quick-fix.

As regards the calcium:magnesium ratio, it only applies to dairy as it is the only food with a 7:1 to 12:1 calcium:magnesium ratio. The only other food that comes close are eggs which are something like 3:1 or 4:1(?) by ratio, last I checked - not enough to be too damaging.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk