I am FrEEEEzing. There's only grainfed fat.

[Roselene]

    What do you think? I tried drinking eggs, eating some grassfed butter, but I definitely need more fat.  There is a big load of butchered today fat here from half a cow.  They say it's organic fed.  They say they baby the cows, feed them corn and oats and grass by hand, and a little hay, but mostly the grain.  They're well and streamfed, untreated.  Would it hurt to eat this grainfed fat?  Which parts are best?

[Roselene]

    Forget I asked, this fat is delishous!  I'll tell you later if I get any different reactions.

[Löwenherz]

   What do you think? I tried drinking eggs, eating some grassfed butter, but I definitely need more fat.  There is a big load of butchered today fat here from half a cow.  They say it's organic fed.  They say they baby the cows, feed them corn and oats and grass by hand, and a little hay, but mostly the grain.  They're well and streamfed, untreated.  Would it hurt to eat this grainfed fat?  Which parts are best?

If you would ask me:

NEVER EVER touch this fat from grainfed diseased cows!

In my false and naive assumption that grass feeding is just an esoteric hype invented by health gurus I have eaten high amounts of grainfed meats + fats from any source for several month without any caution. In 2007 I got seriously ill and needed three years to recover! My whole GI tract was inflamed, my pancreas was damaged, heart problems, mental problems, depressions etc. etc.

I will warn people against grainfed meat until end of my life. And it makes all sense to me:

Diseased and tortured animals ---> Diseased and tortured humans!

BAD KARMA is real.

Best wishes

Löwenherz

[achillezzz]

Av says that most of the toxins are stored in the glands bone marrow and organs and some fats too.
But you can eat steaks and ground even if its from regular groccery shop. I mean he cures his son with that meat in his book.

[Löwenherz]

Av says that most of the toxins are stored in the glands bone marrow and organs and some fats too.
But you can eat steaks and ground even if its from regular groccery shop. I mean he cures his son with that meat in his book.

Yes, the leanest cuts are always the safest.

Av doesn't talk much about the differences between grain feeding and gras feeding.

If I remember correctly he buys most of his meats from US Wellness meats. So these meats are indeed grass fed. Furthermore grain fed is not grain fed. The range from 100% grass fed to mostly grain fed is huge. But AV mentionend very often that supermarket meats should be avoided. It makes sense.

Nevertheless AV greatly underestimates the possible health risks from grain fed meats, IMO.

Löwenherz

[CitrusHigh]

Grass (which is a little vague, really could be many different types of pasture and browse) feeding is real because it is the natural diet for ruminants ingrained in to their genetics in just the same way that meat is ingrained in to a lion's genes. Each animal has a range of foods that fall in to their particular genetic requisites and give the choice, most animals will elect the foods that will produce optimal health in them.

I started off eating standard quality raw meat from the local large supermarket. Soon I got a traveling rash that would move around my body, but no area was off limits, and sometimes it seemed like it was over most of my body. Some of the itchiest and most miserable days of my life. It lasted 1-2 weeks and then vanished never to return. The only thing I tried to treat the symptoms was a little smoked cannabis, and it would work very temporarily. But now with all I've learned in the proceeding three years I strongly recommend all newbies to begin with the most pristine grassfed, organic, or wild meat possible. Also if I could go back in time I would probably use baked (as in brownies, cannabutter, etc) cannabis instead of smoked.

I agree that what goes around seems to come around, so make sure you're supporting sustainable farming and considering more than just yourself!

[Roselene]

Löwenherz I normally do pastured, but was so freezing yesterday.  I think the eggs did help though.  I'm going to be eating the fat the next few days, if it agrees with me.  Then I will avoid grainfed again.  I met the farmer couple husband and wife.  It's a very small farm, and they do organic CSA feed, and are very caring.  They don't like the animals acting wild, which from what they said happens when they let the cows browse.  I wasn't going to argue, since I'm only here a few days.  I met a lady last night who 100 percent pastures her cows.  I may try some milk this morning.

achillezzz Av from what I heard now recommends to make sure the meat is not ground more than once. The butcher last night explained to me that all commercial beef is ground three times to mix the fat well with the meat and not have it chunky, as customers don't like that.  Av says it loses nutrient value when ground more than once.

Löwenherz AV isn't using meat from US Wellness meats.  That company is frozen.  He says frozen eating meat is bad for people's skin.  Could be though he has no skin problems so eats it anyway.

CitrusHigh alas cannibutter is baked and I'm eating raw.  I wouldn't know where to get any anyway, and I'm not a user. 

In another country I could put cannialcohol on my skin for the US Wellness meats, but that story's getting a little twisted for me.  Does frozen meat really harm the skin?  I haven't eaten frozen more than once.

[Josh]

Why does he say frozen is bad for the skin?

I eat frozen and my skin's not the best at the moment.

Could be various explanations though.

[CitrusHigh]

haha roselene, I wasn't suggesting cannabutter for you, I was speaking within the context of seeking relief under the conditions of the aforementioned rash.

But perhaps you would benefit from cannabis. User is a loaded word. It is simply a plant, nothing more. Don't allow a 80 years of racism, politics and junk science color the way you view it. The stuff is natural because it would be here even if we humans weren't there to cultivate it, unlike coke, meth, lsd, and MDMA, etc....

[goodsamaritan]

If you would ask me:

NEVER EVER touch this fat from grainfed diseased cows!

In my false and naive assumption that grass feeding is just an esoteric hype invented by health gurus I have eaten high amounts of grainfed meats + fats from any source for several month without any caution. In 2007 I got seriously ill and needed three years to recover! My whole GI tract was inflamed, my pancreas was damaged, heart problems, mental problems, depressions etc. etc.

I will warn people against grainfed meat until end of my life. And it makes all sense to me:

Diseased and tortured animals ---> Diseased and tortured humans!

BAD KARMA is real.

Best wishes

Löwenherz

Super interesting.
Did you eat this grain fed beef cooked or raw?
How many months?
Were you healthy before you did this?
When was this?

[Roselene]

Why does he say frozen is bad for the skin?

Cause people who ate it got skin problems that cleared up when they ate nonfrozen raw, dogs too.

80 years of racism, politics and junk science color the way you view it. The stuff is natural because it would be here even if we humans weren't there to cultivate it, unlike coke, meth, lsd, and MDMA, etc....

Yes, I know it's all politics and that drugs aren't really bad.  Politics would be funny if ..
those last four haven't been my bag for one second.  I wish .. drugs we're so out of the beaten path, but I'm trying to stick with the raw animal foods as healing and it's working so far.  Eating ground raw turkey with raw egg and raw local honey mixed as I make this entry.

[Josh]

Roselene, do you know which skin problems? No worries if not, but wanna see if it's relevant to my current situation.

[Löwenherz]

Super interesting.
Did you eat this grain fed beef cooked or raw?
How many months?
Were you healthy before you did this?
When was this?

Hi GS,

I have eaten this grain fed beef in the first half year of 2007 for round about four months, nearly every day. It was raw, of course. If will never touch such meats again, but if I had to, I would eat it cooked (well done) only. Cooked meat from diseased animals is much safer, IMO. Heat created toxins are less important in such cases. Other things could be MUCH more harmful. I guess that I have eaten very aggressive forms of e-coli-bacteria (see eatwild.com) beside the tapeworms etc.. Before this experiment I didn't had noteworthy health problems.

Löwenherz

[TylerDurden]

Dead wrong. Raw grainfed meats are way better than cooked, grainfed meats. Cooking does NOT make a food healthier in any way.

[Löwenherz]

Dead wrong. Raw grainfed meats are way better than cooked, grainfed meats. Cooking does NOT make a food healthier in any way.

Tyler,

the point is:

raw grain fed meat is NOT healthy

and

cooked grain fed meat is NOT healthy.

Nobody said that cooking makes a food healthier. I said that cooking meat from diseased animals makes it SAFER for consumption. That's a difference.

Raw grain fed meat CAN cause SEVERE immediate health problems due to aggressive bacteria or whatever. Cooking can destroy harmful e coli strains, for example. That doesn't mean that I recommend cooked grain fed meat. But no doubt, it is definetely SAFER to eat than raw grain fed meat.

Heat created toxins are not healthy, but they never cause SEVERE health problems immediately.

Löwenherz

[Löwenherz]

Nobody said that cooking makes a food healthier. I said that cooking meat from diseased animals makes it SAFER for consumption. That's a difference.

Here is one example:

From Scientific American...

Escherichia coli (E. coli strain 0157:H7) is a bacterium that normally lives in the intestines of people and animals. It is a gram-negative, facultatively anaerobic, rod prokaryote. Under certain conditions it may become pathogenic (disease causing) and cause food poisoning, hemorrhagic diarrhea and kidney failure. E coli O157:H7 produces toxins that damage the lining of the intestine. The strain originates from the intestines of some cattle and spreads to contaminate beef products and milk.

Eating RAW grain fed meat reminds me of playing russian roulette.

Löwenherz

[TylerDurden]

Raw grain fed meat CAN cause SEVERE immediate health problems due to aggressive bacteria or whatever. Cooking can destroy harmful e coli strains, for example. That doesn't mean that I recommend cooked grain fed meat. But no doubt, it is definetely SAFER to eat than raw grain fed meat.

Heat created toxins are not healthy, but they never cause SEVERE health problems immediately.

Löwenherz

  Yet many RPDers claim that raw, grainfed meats are not as harmful compared to cooked meats. But, unfortunately, cooked meats always cause health problems, regardless.

[goodsamaritan]

  Yet many RPDers claim that raw, grainfed meats are not as harmful compared to cooked meats. But, unfortunately, cooked meats always cause health problems, regardless.

probably those rpders didn't eat those grainfed meats on a 4 month stretch.  Maybe they ate them only on travel.

[TylerDurden]

probably those rpders didn't eat those grainfed meats on a 4 month stretch.  Maybe they ate them only on travel.

The ones who mentioned that on other online groups mentioned just eating raw grainfed meats for long periods.

[Josh]

It might depend which grain fed meat we're talking about. Lowest grade supermarket beef is going to be different to animals which are mostly grass fed and free range, but grain finished for example.

The fat profile would still be bad, but I think the meat would differ in nutrition and maybe danger of illness.

[TylerDurden]

It might depend which grain fed meat we're talking about. Lowest grade supermarket beef is going to be different to animals which are mostly grass fed and free range, but grain finished for example.

The fat profile would still be bad, but I think the meat would differ in nutrition and maybe danger of illness.

  When I asked on one occasion, one poster said that her father had eaten raw supermarket meats, yet still recovered his health.

[Löwenherz]

  When I asked on one occasion, one poster said that her father had eaten raw supermarket meats, yet still recovered his health.

Actually "supermarket meats" doesn't mean anything.

I can name you some supermarkets in norhern Germany, Schleswig-Holstein, in which you can find the highest quality 100% grass-fed certified organic beef without any declaration, lying beside all other "normal" meat in the shelves. They sell surplus meat from nearby organic farmers if available.

Löwenherz

[TylerDurden]

Actually "supermarket meats" doesn't mean anything.

I can name you some supermarkets in norhern Germany, Schleswig-Holstein, in which you can find the highest quality 100% grass-fed certified organic beef without any declaration, lying beside all other "normal" meat in the shelves. They sell surplus meat from nearby organic farmers if available.

Löwenherz

In the UK/US, unless the supermarket meat is specifically referred to/labelled as being "grassfed" , then one can be sure that it is grainfed.

[achillezzz]

Lowenherz the study you provided means nothing all it says that this ecoli bacteria lives in the intestines of the animal.
I eat grainfed meat raw some times undercooked for months now and never had a problem.

Maybe because I am buying it from a professional butcher who knows how to cut the meat good so it doesnt come in touch with the intestines.............

As for factory slaughtered grainfed only allah knows how they cut that meat..

sorry for bad english but you feel me right??

I mean you say raw grainfed is bad because of ecoli so its better to cook it.
But e.coli lives only in the intestines so it totally upon the people who slaughter the animal.

[Löwenherz]

I mean you say raw grainfed is bad because of ecoli so its better to cook it.
But e.coli lives only in the intestines so it totally upon the people who slaughter the animal.

e coli is only one possible problem.

Here is an interesting website with some more information about grain fed beef:

www.eatwild.com

Löwenherz