On Voting...

[laterade]

Max you might have a medical condition that you feel requires doctors to help,
but that does not justify stealing from others to pay for those services.

[TylerDurden]

Max has a point. A raw, palaeolithic diet cannot cure absolutely everything. We do have scientific data on how going raw/not eating cooked can improve many age-related conditions such as arthritis/alzheimer's etc. etc., but it would be interesting to find out what sort of conditions cannot be solved by diet - that way we don't give people false hope. I'm sure most genetic conditions cannot be cured, though some symptoms thereof might possibly be reduced, who knows?

[majormark]

This reminds me... some of the ideas in this topic have been raised here as well: http://www.rawpaleoforum.com/hot-topics/what%27s-your-idea-of-a-perfect-society/

@ Tyler: The sort of conditions that cannot be solved by diet are the bad mental programs that people accept into their heads and act upon. I have a feeling this could be more damaging to health than food or at least just as damaging.

Keep happy thoughts  

[MaximilianKohler]

Max you might have a medical condition that you feel requires doctors to help,
but that does not justify stealing from others to pay for those services.

so it's not ok to "steal" money to try and prevent/stop me from having my life waste away in extreme agony and hell, but it's ok to "steal" money in order to prevent someone's non-living structure from burning down.
OK MAN.

and majormark I think you're wrong

[laterade]

....but it's ok to "steal" money in order to prevent someone's non-living structure from burning down.

No, I did not condone this either. That was a terrible attempt to straw man attack me.

[MaximilianKohler]

I don't know what straw man attack is but it was a general comment towards 99% of the people who are against healthcare for everyone, saying the government is stealing our money in order to pay for other people's shit, yet at the same time they don't say anything about how the fire department, etc. are doing the same thing.

It sucks that so many people are raised to not give a shit about anyone else but themselves. Make more money, buy more things.

BTW, you don't condone the fire department?? why the hell not...
sure if everyone was living tribe-like lives with no modern cities or technology that would be fine to say something like that, but different circumstances require different things... in our current city/tech/social structure it would be pretty fucking retarded to not have things like the fire department paid for through taxes... same with healthcare.

[TylerDurden]

Well, if I had my way, everyone would be forced to pay a low flat rate of tax and would be allowed to allocate their tax however they chose. If they refused to allocate a relevant percentage to the police, the police would not be expected to come to the aid of that particular person if his house was burgled etc. If they didn't allocate a certain percentage towards council-rubbish-collection or the local fire-department, they would lose those 2 services, and so on. If they paid twice the expected percentage to the police, they would get twice as much police-protection as those who  paid just the standard percentage etc.

I believe something like this was tried in a study in the US, and most people allocated their fictional tax-dollars to social services etc., with virtually no money going to support the military, for example. Given that the US military is way over-bloated, that might actually be a good thing.

[MaximilianKohler]

That's actually an interesting idea Tyler. One of the very few I've seen.

Most other comments/videos about being anti-tax are plain stupid, naive, selfish, etc. because they don't suggest any other type of societal change(like zeitgeist/venus project does). And to eliminate taxes alone without MAJOR societal change would be moronic and chaotic, and the cause of much human suffering.

[proteus]

Most other comments/videos about being anti-tax are plain stupid, naive, selfish, etc. because they don't suggest any other type of societal change(like zeitgeist/venus project does). And to eliminate taxes alone without MAJOR societal change would be moronic and chaotic, and the cause of much human suffering.

yeah whatever, did you read my article ?

http://www.diy-av.net/?p=36

[laterade]

I don't support any agencies claim that they are right to or obligated to initiate violence to pay for their services.
The idea of small government is a pipe dream, once they have that power they only grow.
Most of us work to obtain money honestly, there is no reason these humans should not.

... naive, selfish....

so it's not ok to "steal" money to try and prevent/stop me from having my life waste away in extreme agony and hell...

[proteus]

I don't support any agencies claim that they are right to or obligated to initiate violence to pay for their services.
The idea of small government is a pipe dream, once they have that power they only grow.
Most of us work to obtain money honestly, there is no reason these humans should not.

violence is not the issue.  i debunk that aspect of Stefan Molyneux's philosophy here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUMm0OeQiC0

[laterade]

Fetus... IMO, The problem is not violence itself, the problem is that this group of people are glorified, by indirect victims, of the violence they initiate and even get the victims to pay for it themselves. It is like one big S&M club.

Max... I am not trying to give the message that I only care about myself in some darwinian way, or that your life is any less valuable than mine. To put it in better terms, I do not trust the industry whom will receive the money to be sincere or effective. No, I do not have the answer to your problem, but that does not give anyone the justification to redistribute my money to an industry that has abused me.

[proteus]

the problem is that this group of people are glorified, by indirect victims, of the violence they initiate

that's the circle of life to you.  parents abuse their kids to get their love.  women f*ck with their boyfriends' heads to get their attention.  governments put you in prison to get your respect.

you only need ask why a person is born ?  a person is born because somebody needs a slave ( usually that somebody is the parents plus the government ).  if a slave isn't needed in a civilized society a condom or abortion is used.  one day this natural born slave discovers that he doesn't have many freedoms despite being told that he is free and is surprised to learn that

[laterade]

Having kids for slaves? It would appear that most people have kids because sex is a fun past time and rubbers suck.
I want kids because that is the best way to change the world, by literally creating strong people.
There is also the aspect of continuing your lineage because people typically don't live forever. 

[proteus]

sex is a fun past time and rubbers suck.

what a load of crap.  there is abortion for this.

I want kids because

i'm sure your kids care a lot which whim of your immature self is responsible for their life of slavery.

[laterade]

Fetus... What do you propose? Stop having kids to end slavery?

Go ahead, take that route. It might be for the better.

[proteus]

Fetus... What do you propose?

i propose you take responsibility for your actions.  if you have kids you are more or less responsible for all the crap that's going to happen to them with the exception of minor things like car accidents or failed tests for which they will be responsible themselves.

but the fact that they will be forced to pay taxes will be YOUR responsibility.

so when your kids spit in your face you get on your knees and beg their forgiveness.

realize the relationship between Citizen and State parallels almost 100% that of Child and Parent.