The coconut

[achillezzz]

I am thinking about adding more fats to my diet and I want it to be from coconut butter!
But whats so special about the coconut? coconut oil? coconut butter? coconut in general?
How much omega3 does it has  whats the ratio is it good to eat lots of it??
I'm thinking about mixing cold pressed coconut butter with raw honey and eat huge ammount everyday of this mixture!

I just need more information on coconuts to know what Im doing here.

Thanks 

[goodsamaritan]

I know coconut meat has anti-parasitic properties as well.

[Josh]

It seems really toxic to me. It just makes me feel sick. You know it contains a lot of lauric acid which is not found in meat?

I tried the 'coconut oil detox' as it seemed a possible way to kill and restructure gut bacteria, but by the end of it I never wanted to touch coconut oil again.

[sabertooth]

Coconut oil sucks for me as well, gives me the runs and doesn't level out my energy like coconut butter does. I haven't had any issues at all with coconut butter. I am currently out of coconut butter and have tried eatting bits of dehydrated coconut, but its not much good. I seem to thrive off of the carb and fat mixture within coconut butter.

I have spent the last three days on zero carbs without any coconut, and have managed well, by substituting it with more brains and organ meats. I have eaten three lamb brains in the past three days.
The store will have it back in three days so I will just use this time to continue my ZC experiment.

I have tried mixing honey with it, but I don't tolerate honey in general too well. I eat about three tablespoons of coconut butter with each meal ,usually, and it has worked wonders. I go through about two jars a week.

[Iguana]

I am thinking about adding more fats to my diet and I want it to be from coconut butter!
But whats so special about the coconut? coconut oil? coconut butter? coconut in general?
How much omega3 does it has  whats the ratio is it good to eat lots of it??
I'm thinking about mixing cold pressed coconut butter with raw honey and eat huge ammount everyday of this mixture!

I'm sorry to tell you, but this is a perfect example of a wrong (modern) way of thinking. Instead, just get some coconuts in their different states of ripeness, take the smell and taste of their unmixed, unprocessed water and flesh and see what you like and how much of it you currently like.

[sabertooth]

Raw whole coconut has too much of a laxative effect for me to be able to consume enough of its fat and carbs to give me the maximum benefits that I recieve from eatting the butter. I am very much on board with the philosophy that{ in general} paleo foods in their whole unprocessed state are optimal. But from personal experience I must contend that the coconut butter is better.

(at least for me)

[KD]

Raw whole coconut has too much of a laxative effect for me to be able to consume enough of its fat and carbs to give me the maximum benefits that I recieve from eatting the butter. I am very much on board with the philosophy that{ in general} paleo foods in their whole unprocessed state are optimal. But from personal experience I must contend that the coconut butter is better.

(at least for me)

how much is enough? did you have the pecans and raisins waiting to tell you? the durian?

paleo man knew nothing about fats and carbs

or how to open jars

you eat processed food with every meal thus confuse your body when eat whole coconut

Paleo man would buy 5-6 coconuts..eat part of a coconut, get diarrhea and throw the rest in the garbage..and then call on the phone and get lean section animals to eat then eat figs. all natural unprocessed and sustainable.

[miles]

Of course early HUmans knew about fats and carbs.. They just didn't call them 'fats and carbs'... I guess the earliest didn't call them anything, but they would still recognise them.

Through trial an error over generations, if early HUman found he could improve coconut by processing it to a butter he would. He could also store it for lean times then, like bees with their honey. What's early though? They wouldn't have been able to come of with anything like that before the language-explosion.

Processing food is natural, but... when it is bad is when the way things are processed has no functional purpose. When it is only to increase profit by reducing labour; to make it easier pack; to make up for poor health of produce or damage done by previous pointless processing; to comply with regulations or cultural norms etc... In this case the effect on health is overlooked for profit. Processing to make something better is another matter.

[KD]

heh.

I believe alot of the pro-cooking folks are correct in a sense, with many of the advancements of humans perpetuating differnt developments that would have not happened without sequential mastery of such things. On the physical level some of these were not perhaps great, but had certain necessities and results.

Now we have the luxury to assess which things yield negative or positive results, or what tools we can use to reverse certain problems created by having so many processes, chemicals etc..

Of couse meats and fruits tend not to need any processing (some argue meat does but whatever) but if people are to need other nutients or fuel sources from other things found in nature - because they are not comming form a place of health or a variety of other reasons-  often these have to be processed. Juice, fermentation, or cooking of herbs/vegetables to juicing,fermentation, processing of coconuts.

coconut oil/butter: I'm not a big fan of it personally, but the idea as I see it is to eat more than one would be able to get in nature. More calories of fat from coconuts... as fat from animals is sometimes hard to come by and/or provide additional concentrated nutrients. Perhaps the people who lived in the tropics had the time and metabolism and existing health to eat a high saturated fat diet that is high in carbs, but most people do not, so for them eating some non-100% ideal food that works as a fat is better than eating some non-ideal diet that is unprocessed.

Common sense says avoiding everything potentially harmful would be the best move..but not eating one thing means inevitably eating something else which also has its own consequences. Even if one can prove a certain kind of process is bad through some kind of isolated experiement or trends there is always going to be someone using that process to some effect that they find positive. Eating nearly all tallow and ground animal parts..thats certainly processing. yet 99.9% of the all raw unprocessed diets seem to have less results. Obviously certain things are more important than others. go figure

[Josh]

Good post KD.

eating nearly all tallow and ground animal parts..thats certainly processing. yet 99.9% of the all raw unprocessed diets seem to have less results

I think Lex had good results because he stuck with his diet for long periods of time so his body could adapt, not changing on a whim, and also because of the variety of organs in the diet. I don't necessarily think he'd get worse results eating whole organs, meat etc in the right proportions if that were convenient to do (which it can't be in this day and age really)

[KD]

Good post KD.

eating nearly all tallow and ground animal parts..thats certainly processing. yet 99.9% of the all raw unprocessed diets seem to have less results

I think Lex had good results because he stuck with his diet for long periods of time so his body could adapt, not changing on a whim, and also because of the variety of organs in the diet. I don't necessarily think he'd get worse results eating whole organs, meat etc in the right proportions if that were convenient to do (which it can't be in this day and age really)

heh, yeah in most cases...there isn't going to be problems with eating only whole foods, except if it includes alot of foods that generally can't be assimilated well raw or there are other compromised issues. So youre right its more an issue of what takes most importance, not necessarily an issue of the processing being beneficial per se.  The mindset that one is definitively getting everything they need from what will inevitably be a modernized limited sampling of the nutrients to those found in nature - and dismissing other sources is another thing. I personally believe some people might in fact need those nutrients and minerals from those 'fractured' or processing of foods, even if our ancestors did not, but thats somewhat less important to what I was saying. Although its worth keeping in mind that all known humans on the timeline process some type of food...and usually quite a bit, so in the least some processes are clearly more disease forming than others and some diets no matter how raw or whole are going to be ineffective if they don't deliver the right nutrition for the current state of health.

So what I was saying was that you can find countless people over the internet claiming their raw whole foods diet is the natural human diet and all that is needed for a modern person - blasting any type of processing as unhealthy - and yet be presenting a diet that is not only ineffective but likely unnatural itself in its types and groupings of foods.

[sabertooth]

how much is enough? did you have the pecans and raisins waiting to tell you? the durian?

paleo man knew nothing about fats and carbs

or how to open jars

you eat processed food with every meal thus confuse your body when eat whole coconut

Paleo man would buy 5-6 coconuts..eat part of a coconut, get diarrhea and throw the rest in the garbage..and then call on the phone and get lean section animals to eat then eat figs. all natural unprocessed and sustainable.

Now you are talking out of your rear. Or maybe I misinterpret?

Coconut butter is not processed in the way that many people think about processed foods. Its whole coconut that has the laxative liquid mechanically removed through cold pressing. It contains all the elements of a raw coconut without the laxative enzymes. Its not much different from drying or aging meat to make it more easily digestible.

I repeat, the results are freaking amazing, my health and vitality are at an alltime high and I have the pictures, blood work, and athletic vitality to prove it. I care not for any purist philosophical ideals expoused here, in regards to coconut butter , I Use my sense of well being to guild my decisions now, and I instinctively feel that eatting jars of coconut butter is fine. Personally speaking

[KD]

how much is enough? did you have the pecans and raisins waiting to tell you? the durian?

paleo man knew nothing about fats and carbs

or how to open jars

Now you are talking out of your rear. Or maybe I misinterpret?

Coconut butter is not processed in the way that many people think about processed foods. Its whole coconut that has the laxative liquid mechanically removed through cold pressing. It contains all the elements of a raw coconut without the laxative enzymes. Its not much different from drying or aging meat to make it more easily digestible.

I repeat, the results are freaking amazing, my health and vitality are at an alltime high and I have the pictures, blood work, and athletic vitality to prove it. I care not for any purist philosophical ideals expoused here, in regards to coconut butter , I Use my sense of well being to guild my decisions now, and I instinctively feel that eatting jars of coconut butter is fine. Personally speaking

was 100% sarcasm. I tried to modify it after the more 'serious' conversation started..but the edit is well under 24 hrs now it seems.

of course not only did ancient peoples know about how such things worked in their bodies, but also had huge limitations in terms of what types of things were available which led to making the best use of those things. Being far more natural than ranges/proportions of foods that would not exist.

Obviously the OP just wanted a sign off on whether it was ok to eat as a staple food, not philosophy as you say.

[sabertooth]

Its not just the ancients that were unaware of how foods worked on the body, many people of the modern era are plagued with the same ignorance. I currently am forced by economics to make huge gambles with the dietary choices for my family. They eat much of their food from the local Kroger's and a good deal of it is commercially produced and processed. Much of humanity still has huge limitations when it comes to the availability of the most rawsome foods.

Ignorance about what is optimal is a universal phenomenon that all of humanity is subject too. In regards to religion, science, and food.

That being said I use all that I have available to insure that my children receive a balanced diet. My little ones love coconut butter, and they swarm me at meal time and would hog it all if I let them. Its supprizing how well young ones can thrive if you can add large amounts of quality fat to their diet. Even children who eat a fair amount of grains can do well if they also have access to a fair amount of paleo friendly food. I will add lamb fat or butter to much of what they eat.

[miles]

If they're going to eat grains and legumes and stuff you should learn to prepare it in a traditional way, such as making sourdough bread.

[Löwenherz]

I am thinking about adding more fats to my diet and I want it to be from coconut butter!
But whats so special about the coconut? coconut oil? coconut butter? coconut in general?
How much omega3 does it has  whats the ratio is it good to eat lots of it??
I'm thinking about mixing cold pressed coconut butter with raw honey and eat huge ammount everyday of this mixture!

I just need more information on coconuts to know what Im doing here.

Thanks 

Coconuts are magic!

After years of raw paleo low carb dieting I tend to believe that fresh raw coconut cream is better than ANY other fat, including all animal fats.

But coconut oil and all coconut convenience products (including the raw versions) are completely useless IMO.

Aloha!

Löwenherz

[RogueFarmer]

If they're going to eat grains and legumes and stuff you should learn to prepare it in a traditional way, such as making sourdough bread.

IMO the best grains and legumes dishes are either dosas or idli (fermented mixture of mung or adzuki beans with brown or red cargo rice) or rice and optional beans first fermented a bit with whey and then cooked slowly with meat broth.

Nourishing traditions and Cure tooth decay have very good advice for making the SAD diet better. Weston Price said that one good meal a day improved tooth health I think 95%, even when the rest of the day's meals contained white flour and white sugar products.

Really the best bet for cheap food IMO is potatoes. Wouldn't be hard at all to grow your own in your own back yard either.

Oh and it's very possible to get a dairy farmer to give you large quantities of raw milk for rather cheap. Gotta find a good pasture based one though or it probably ain't worth it.


You could always get your own dairy cow!

I won't argue whether raw meat or raw milk is a better product, I really don't know personally. The reason why I chose to consume more milk than meat is because of the ease, because I like it better (though not all of the time, variety rules) and because milk is far superior in the economic department. I could keep one beef cow and raise her offspring for meat and get less than 600 pounds of meat a year or I could keep a dairy cow and get 10k pounds of milk a year + less than 400 pounds of meat a year, but just as much bones and guts as a beef cow.

Oh this thread is about coconuts! Sorry to take it so far off topic!

[zeno]

I was gifted several old coconuts. How would you recommend that I utilize the fat that is in the coconut? I have a blender and a juicer at my disposal but would prefer a raw, simple technique.

In the Philippines I asked how does one enjoy the coconut meat and the most common reply was to use it in cooking.

Although this requires cooking, I was thinking about just tossing the meat in a bone broth and allow the fat to slowly separate and join with the animal fat. Doesn't that sound yummy?

I'm in need of some recommendations from the coconut eaters!

[balancing-act]

And more questions for anyone... what's the total idiot-proof way of opening coconuts? Cause I had the hardest time with it last time I had them, and online videos are confusing me. Bang it with a hammer? I basically have no tools and grew up clueless in the suburbs.

Also, Lowenherz, I assume you include my cans of Native Forest coconut milk as a "convenience product"- what's so bad about canned coconut milk?

I'm just looking for a simple way to use coconut as a salad dressing. 

[zeno]

And more questions for anyone... what's the total idiot-proof way of opening coconuts? Cause I had the hardest time with it last time I had them, and online videos are confusing me. Bang it with a hammer? I basically have no tools and grew up clueless in the suburbs.

Either bang it with a hammer as the coconut is wrapped in a towel or use some sort of machete like blade to cut it. If you have a weak/dull blade you can use a blunt object (such as a hammer) to smack the back the of the blade driving it deeper into the coconut until it splits.

Also, Lowenherz, I assume you include my cans of Native Forest coconut milk as a "convenience product"- what's so bad about canned coconut milk?

Although Native Forest claims their cans are free of BPA, they may contain several other chemicals that consumers are not familiar with. The safest bet is to avoid foods in unsafe packaging which may leach into the food. This is just one concern among a few.

This raises the question of the necessity of the coconut in the diet of people living outside of tropical climates in general. In my opinion, if you aren't living in Thailand or the Philippines, you truly shouldn't be eating such foods in any shape or form. Try substituting it with something locally sourced. Although coconut made do you wonders, eventually you'll have to give it up and not recognizing so is just a crutch.

[balancing-act]

I'll try the hammer and towel....
I'm not clear why I should give up coconut just because it doesn't grow locally. You think we should totally exclusively eat local foods? I don't think there are any plant fats around here that will nourish me. I don't see why I can't buy avocados and coconuts from Florida. ?

[RawZi]

And more questions for anyone... what's the total idiot-proof way of opening coconuts? Cause I had the hardest time with it last time I had them, and online videos are confusing me. Bang it with a hammer? I basically have no tools and grew up clueless in the suburbs....I'm just looking for a simple way to use coconut as a salad dressing. 

    You might try these three ingredients raw: tomatoes, cilantro and coconut. Don't add water. Leave this paste a thick consistency. Eat it on salad. I'm not sure how healthy it is, but some find it tasty.

[Löwenherz]

Also, Lowenherz, I assume you include my cans of Native Forest coconut milk as a "convenience product"- what's so bad about canned coconut milk?

Raw fats are much better than cooked fats..

Canned coconut milk doesn't work for me.

Löwenherz

[zeno]

I'm not clear why I should give up coconut just because it doesn't grow locally. You think we should totally exclusively eat local foods? I don't think there are any plant fats around here that will nourish me. I don't see why I can't buy avocados and coconuts from Florida. ?

Enjoying these fruits from time to time for special occasions seems rational to me. However, making these foods a staple of your diet which are unnatural to your local environment seems foolish. Just think about it: These fruits travel all the way from the Philippines (or even Florida, in the case of avocados) creating all sorts of pollution along the way just for your enjoyment and are only accessible because of transportation. Doesn't this seem extreme? We Americans tend to think that this process is natural because we are raised in a culture of exuberance and convenience. Also: What will you do when suddenly you can't receive your beloved coconuts or avocados?

This perspective may be extreme but it is my sincere opinion and I thought I might share just to offer a challenging perspective.

[Dorothy]

There are entire diets based completely on eating only what you can get locally and is in season. Macrobiotics is a good example. Then there is Susan Weed that says that eating wild plants from your environment is the best food possible and that one leaf of a local plant will do you more good that bowls and bowls of farm grown leaves. The idea is that plants that grow in your native environment are adapted to the same environment that you are in and will help you to adapt and be strong to survive there like they do. The plants and animals in a place evolved together so another way of looking at it is that the plants that evolved in your area are the ones that created themselves to be best for the animals (you) that live in that place.

Then as Zeno says, it's environmentally more responsible and if you eat what is local your food source will be more stable if supply lines breakdown.

Those are the theories and reasonings. I still eat some tropical fruits, but what these people say I think is valid. I'm not living fully in-tune with my environment and am not as adapted to it as I would like to be and probably not as strong and healthy as I could be because of it.