EGGS

[igibike]

Since this issue interests me quite much, I open a new post, not to spoil iceman's journal.

Main facts so far pointed out are:

- bioavalilability of egg's protein: I suppose the reason is "avidin" contained in eggs, even if I have to say that eggs protein are used as a reeference for measuring the biological value of proteins
- allergy to eggs: some people claim that they are allergic to eggs. I have a question here. Wich are the symptoms ?
- fertilized eggs: here in Italy there's no mark (in my knowledge) on eggs to state if tehy are fertilized on not. How do you recognize a fertilized egg ?
- some say that problems arised if they relied on eggs only as a source of fats.

What are you experiences re eggs ?
Any useful information to share ?


I start with my experience:

I started have eggs at breakfast some years ago (only whites first cooked or not).
Then (2.5 years ago) I started eating whole eggs, cooked.
1 year ago, i switched to an almost entirely raw omnivorous regimen, since then I eat 3 whole raw eggs per day at breakfast.

So far I didn't notice any problem.
In a few months I'm going to have blood tests, so I weill be able to have more informations.

Any contribution is welcome.

[TylerDurden]

Well, 3 eggs a day isn't as extreme as some.

The way you recognise fertilised eggs is to look inside the yolk and you'll see a red nucleus forming(or embryo, if the eggs have beeen fertilised some time ago), judging from what I've heard. I've never actually seen a fertilised egg in the UK as they're almost unheard of.

Re health:- I noticed a slowed healing-rate after eating too many raw eggs a day. I can't remember exact specific details, except that I would feel stronger on those days when I ate meats instead of eggs. These days, it's less of an issue as I've recovered, healthwise.

[goodsamaritan]

I found out I and my 5 year old boy are allergic to fake eggs / un-fertilized eggs / chicken menstruation.

Now that I have found my sources of raw fertilized eggs, both duck and chicken, we are fine and happy.

Of course I learned not to depend on eggs just recently, seems they are not body building enough, I need real solid meat.

So it is raw fertilized eggs for me or none at all.

[Squall]

I found out I and my 5 year old boy are allergic to fake eggs / un-fertilized eggs / chicken menstruation.

I keep seeing this occasionally. Are unfertilized eggs really just chicken periods? Man if that's true, I'm gonna have some serious fun telling everyone who's eating eggs that!

[Python]

I think that they are, indeed, chicken periods as they are an unfertilized egg passed from the body of an animal.

I've noticed thus far that eggs mostly elevate my hormone levels, reverse most of the symptoms from sexual overexertion(headaches, inability to focus, general "blah" sensations). In this light, I view them more as a snack food or hormone-fuel than anything else. I haven't eaten them in large amounts, though, so I can't say if half a dozen eggs or more will have any different effect on the body.

[iceman]

Have you tried eating just the yolks, raw?  The yolks have almost the same amount of protein as the whites.

Interestingly, I just saw fertilized eggs for sale this morning at the Whole Foods Market here in Texas.  Whole Foods is a grocery store so the fertilized thing must be catching on.     

[Raw Kyle]

The idea of infertile eggs seems strange now, obviously in the wild the only eggs you would find in a nest will have been fertilized. It also seems very plausible that there would be all kinds of hormonal differences that could cause health problems in unfertilized eggs.

But then again maybe not. I'm just surprised every time I read something that makes so much sense and I haven't really thought of it before, because I spend (and spent) so much time thinking/reading about diet/health.

[igibike]

Iceman, I tried just the yolks, and they are great, but cannot sand throw away food, so I went back to eat the whole egg.
In the fertilize egg you foud was there a label stating they were fertilized ?

Kyle, I think in the wild you just cannot know if the eggs you find are ferilized or not (util you open it).
This is my thought about that: a bird expell the egg anyway (whether if it has copulated or not), so during reproduction times you would have found fertilized eggs, during non reprodution times the eggs were unfertilized (every animal species have cyclical reproduction times). If eggs were eaten, then I believe they were eaten both fertilized and unferitlized, because if eggs were recognized as "good" every egg found would be eaten. IMHO

[TylerDurden]

Iceman, I tried just the yolks, and they are great, but cannot sand throw away food, so I went back to eat the whole egg.
In the fertilize egg you foud was there a label stating they were fertilized ?

Kyle, I think in the wild you just cannot know if the eggs you find are ferilized or not (util you open it).
This is my thought about that: a bird expell the egg anyway (whether if it has copulated or not), so during reproduction times you would have found fertilized eggs, during non reprodution times the eggs were unfertilized (every animal species have cyclical reproduction times). If eggs were eaten, then I believe they were eaten both fertilized and unferitlized, because if eggs were recognized as "good" every egg found would be eaten. IMHO

I'm afraid this is rather unlikely. You see, the only reason why domesticated chickens manage to produce so many unfertilised eggs each year is that they are bred genetically for that purpose over millenia,fed on diets extremely high in grains and are kept away from male cockerels, which would not be the case in the wild. Birds in the wild generally lay only a few eggs a year, usually during a breeding season, not just for human consumption, so 99% of the time the eggs would have been fertilised, due to the presence of male cockerels. Only, in very unusual circumstances, where local predators had killed off the male cockerels etc., would eggs from wild birds be unfertilised.

[igibike]

Uhm, this makes sense, Tyler.
But can we assume this unfertilized egg were eaten, if found ?
In this case humans got used to digest them...

[TylerDurden]

Uhm, this makes sense, Tyler.
But can we assume this unfertilized egg were eaten, if found ?
In this case humans got used to digest them...

Not if the amount of unfertilised eggs eaten was very small. Besides, we humans haven't really adapted to dairy after 9,000 years of drinking the stuff, let alone cooked-food which we've been eating for 250,000 years or so - (to adapt fully to cooked-food one would have to be completely immune to the effects of the toxins in cooked-foods such as AGEs(advanced glycation endproducts/heterocyclic amines(HCAs) etc.) Those anti-rawists who argue that we need to be on a cooked-diet for health-reasons would, in order to be logical in their argument, have to argue that we need to absorb those very toxins in cooked-foods in order to stay healthy, as the primary differences between raw food and cooked-food is that raw food has a higher water-content, that raw food has far fewer harmful toxins(In a general sense) than cooked-foods, and that raw food has  higher nutrient-levels.

[igibike]

Now I'm thinking about my breakfast...

What will be of it....

[iceman]

In the fertilize egg you foud was there a label stating they were fertilized ?

Yes, the egg carton was boldly labeled "FERTILIZED EGGS", the same way it would say "FREE RANGE" or "ORGANIC".

[Raw Kyle]

Uhm, this makes sense, Tyler.
But can we assume this unfertilized egg were eaten, if found ?
In this case humans got used to digest them...

Well there's a difference between adapting to digest one unfertilized egg in 5 years (as most found eggs would be fertilized) vs. adapting to eating several a day.

[Satya]

I think everyone who eats and wants to talk about eggs needs to raise their own birds for it, and then talk about it.  Otherwise, all you are doing is making assumptions on what you think is natural and healthy in the natural world.  Or if you can't raise, go study birds in nature and report back.  Chickens lay whether or not there is a rooster.  So it is similar to the release of an egg by mammals; but chickens do it nearly daily, so not really very similar to mentruation in that respect, is it?  Roosters will KILL hens from incessant mating unless the ratio is something like 15+ hens to 1 rooster.  How natural is that when the normal brood is about even hens and roosters?  Unfertilized eggs may happen from time to time yes.  And when you consider the amount in real seasons of available eggs, every day just is not an option for consumption of eggs in any natural sense.

[igibike]

I see what you mean, Kyle.

So, Satya, it seems that you advice not to eat eggs everyday as well, don't you ?
What you say about the raise of birds definitely akes sense. My uncle and other people I know used (or use) to raise their own birds and then sell the eggs. I saw with my eyes that usually hens are kept separated from the rooster.
Some people say that if you buy egg from hens raise at open air, they are almost 100% fertilized, qhile this may not be true if you buy egg from hens that are raised closed.

I buy every week 10 eggs from ground raised and 12 from open air raised, but I don't know if the rooster is free.

[Satya]

We killed our rooster sometime back, as I don't want to raise chickens all the time anymore and did not want endless chicks.  It really ties you to the house as they have to be let our in the yard everyday and put up in the coop at night.  I want to be able to travel more without trying to find someone to take care of the chickens daily.

There was no way to keep the rooster away from the hens with our set up.  Plus, the rooster would crow all day long!  He became a nuisance.  My eggs are still far superior to any store eggs, and I have heard that fertilized eggs are better for men than women, but I can't remember where I heard that from.  It IS more natural to have them mostly fertilized, but they are a seasonal food anyway.  Like milk.  Milk comes from lactating momma cows, not just any cow without a calf.  It is not something you can have everyday in nature.

[igibike]

I see...

re milk, of course it's seasonal
re eggs, as you say, they deposit eggs almost daily, so I assume if a farm has (for example) 10 hens, then he would have some eggs everyday.
The guy I knew who raised hens had a lot of egg to sell everyday.
Of course this doesn't mean I have to eat eggs everyday, I see...
The fact is that they are so easily manageable...
The other option would be to use the same meat/mix for breafast as well...

What do you do in this regard ?

[Satya]

I see...

re milk, of course it's seasonal
re eggs, as you say, they deposit eggs almost daily, so I assume if a farm has (for example) 10 hens, then he would have some eggs everyday.
The guy I knew who raised hens had a lot of egg to sell everyday.
Of course this doesn't mean I have to eat eggs everyday, I see...
The fact is that they are so easily manageable...
The other option would be to use the same meat/mix for breafast as well...

What do you do in this regard ?

Eggs are seasonal too.  In my region, chickens don't lay for a month or 2 in winter, and a month or 2 in summer.

I would say have the meat mix on occasion.  Or make ceviche with fish, shrimp or scallops.  Or try carpaccio with steak, olive oil and garlic.

[igibike]

Ok, thank you Satya,

What you suggest is good, but quite boring for me. But I'll give it a try, and I'll see how I feel.

[Raw Kyle]

I would agree with everything said except that chickens lay eggs every day. That is something modern chickens do, I think you would be hard pressed to find anything close to a wild ancestor of the chicken that lays anywhere near as many eggs per year as the domestic chicken. I believe that chicken is bred from the jungle fowl, of which I know practically nothing, but modern chickens definitely have the traits of greatly increased breast to body ratio and increased egg laying.

[Satya]

I raise Silkie Bantams, which are known as layers.  They do not lay daily year round.  I live in the country.  My neighbors have chickens - leghorns and reds - and these hens take some time off in winter and late in summer too.  My lamb farmers raise layers for egg sale.  And they don't lay daily 365, either.  Perhaps feedlot birds are treated differently such that they feel the necessity to lay until they drop.  I would not be surprised.  It is also known that layers lay for 3 years and quit.  Mine are coming on 4 years and still lay.  But now that it's getting colder, they are not laying right now.  But this has been the case since the hens were old enough to start laying.

Anyone else here raise any of their own food?

[Raw Kyle]

Just plants so far, no animals.

It is well known that hormones are given in the feed of commercial chickens to get them to produce more, but still any breed of chicken you can now buy will have been selected over hundreds of years as the highest producer of it's species. The only way to compare egg laying would be to compare domesticated animals with wild ones, comparing different domestic animals doesn't seem like it would accomplish much towards this end to me.

[Satya]

The only way to compare egg laying would be to compare domesticated animals with wild ones, comparing different domestic animals doesn't seem like it would accomplish much towards this end to me.

But I am demonstrating from experience that domestic chickens don't lay every day of the year, which is what you claimed.  So there is no need to go further and compare with the wild birds to establish this particular fact... unless you don't believe me. 

[Raw Kyle]

I suppose I was exaggerating to make the point. It's true that your chickens didn't lay once a day every day, but some commercial chickens lay several times a day all year until they are worn down from it and then slaughtered. I should have said that even the amount your chickens or anyone else raising their chickens free range receive eggs seems high to me. In terms of survival I don't see much advantage in laying eggs more than a few times a season if that.