Before you believe what you read on Quackwatch read this

[raw-al]

http://www.healthfreedomlaw.com/

Finally someone is fighting back those liars and crooks

[TylerDurden]

If you want credibility for your accusations, it's a really bad idea to cite Hulda Clark as a "wronged" person. She is one of the biggest frauds around. She is also highly anti-rawpalaeo in her notions that parasites exist everywhere..

[raw-al]

She did beat the guy (or organization) in court, however I agree that she is not what I would call a shining example. She reminds me of Aajonus. There's some truth in there.

I cringed at first when I saw her picture at the top of the page.

[goodsamaritan]

Hulda Clark is not perfect (she likes artificial vitamins and sterilizes her food), but we have to give her credit for many things:

- Pollution avoidance... she was very thorough and opens peoples eyes to what should be obvious

- Dental cleansing, root canals, mercury, metals in teeth... she promoted this too.

- Liver flushing... she promoted this too.

- Zapper... she donated her invention / plans and research to the world for free so that anyone can make improvements and make their own zappers

- She repopularized frequency generators ala Royal Rife... so out came the Beam Ray machines

- She popularized parasites as part of the cause of disease when coupled with pollution... the parasites that we generally peacefully coexist with migrate to organs where they are not supposed to be and cause havoc.

- She popularized herbal dewormers... where master herbalists improved on her research.

So Hulda Clark is BIG... very big... she deserves credit.  Her principles and teachings work.  Too bad she did not discover raw paleo dieting for herself.  That is her biggest flaw why she died too young.

[raw-al]

You are right GS but she also tells everyone to eat with plastic cutlery on plastic plates. This is not only inaccurate, it is dangerous especially for young girls and boys. It has been linked to younger puberty in girls which affects their mental development etc and with boys it has been linked with lethargy, depression etc. Many books on the subject.

That's why I said she is like AV. He has great ideas and bogus ones also.

[Alive]

Plus Quackwatch is trying to debunk the dietary Acid/Alkaline science which is well proven.

http://www.freeworldfilmworks.com/ahw-ph2.htm

http://www.eateco.org/Medical/ProtOsteoporosis.htm

http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FPNS%2FPNS61_02%2FS0029665102000630a.pdf&code=e04f6f6ebd839810e051a6bcc1b17fc3

http://experiencelife.com/article/the-ph-factor/

http://www.isaoz.com/Docs/E-pH-NutritionGuideToAcidAlkalineBalance.pdf

http://www.online-ganoderma.com/page/14235/default.asp

[TylerDurden]

Actually, the acid alkali theory has been well debunked so quackwatch is vindicated, I am afraid.

[Dorothy]

Hulda Clark didn't invent any of those things except the zapper GS. She just put them into compendiums of paranoia.

The thing about Hulda that should give everyone pause is that she said that she had the cure for cancer and all illnesses and that her zapper would make anyone heal of cancer................. then she DIED of cancer. Hulda made lots and lots of money I am sure and has steered too many people away from things that could be of much more value to them.

Quackwatch to me is a lot like the Sloan Kettering site for researching alternative cancer cures. You go to it knowing that if there is anything at all that can be said negative about something they will say it and then some. But that is a useful service if you have a truly open and discerning mind. I found some doozies of great cures at the Sloan Kettering site. Take one - cesium. They said cesium was proven to have ONLY a 50% cure rate. I thought WHAT? THAT'S AMAZING! Then researched it more and it got even more amazing. It would have probably a 100% cure rate if the people they tried it on weren't already as close to death as you can get and didn't already have their organs destroyed from chemo and radiation. Another was pectasol - c. Sloan couldn't come up with one bad thing to say. It worked. Period. Nothing they could say on any front to disprove it. Amazing and valuable information. Quackwatch is where I learned that Hulda died of cancer. I verified it. Done. I could stop wasting my time trying to figure out which complicated scenarios in her books I had to take seriously and move onto something with more promise.

To anyone that is using half their brain Quackwatch is just the other pendulum swing and can't be relied upon just like you can't take every alternative thing as gospel just because someone made a claim either. The truth is in the middle and important gems of knowledge can be unearthed at any place in the pendulum as long as you remember that it is a pendulum.

[Alive]

Tyler, Where are your links for this 'debunking' of the net alkaline forming diet theory?

[TylerDurden]

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/DSH/coral2.html

http://skeptigirl.wordpress.com/2010/01/16/skeptic-at-work-the-alkaline-diet/

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/lifestyle/health/alkaline-diets-are-silly-but-harmless-6389368.html

[Alive]

Well with a simple experiment that you can discard all of these links:
1/ Mix 1 teaspoon of baking soda in a glass
2/ Drink on an empty stomach
3/ Test = do you start burping?

If these guys are right and your stomach always contains acid then adding bicarbonate will create copious amounts of gas and you will burp a lot. Most kids know baking soda + acid (eg vinegar) = gas (great for blowing up bottles).

I have never burped after drinking this mixture, so I conclude your links are wrong and that I stomachs are not always full of acid. Instead I suggest our stomachs sense what we have put into them and only create acid when it is actually required, and at the required strength.

Links 1 & 3 are doctors - useful if you've cut your leg off, but I bet your wouldn't take their nutritional advice!
Link 2 is just an idiot.

I would rather listen to Anthony Sebastian of UCSF medical school who has spent decades studying and experimenting with net alkaline balance.

[raw-al]

Personally I consider that Quackwatch is written by members of the "Worldwide Union of Allopathic Doctors and Drug Producers" for their own personal financial gain. They are willing to subsidize this website as it brings them money. No other way of putting it. They could give a sh*t about your health.

Interesting thing to consider re: alkaline/acidity...

One article by Nenah Sylver PhD. quoting Ken Uzzell, that I read about 'Inclined Bed Therapy is that the inventer (or should I say person, Andrew K. Fletcher [UK] who figured it out and did some experiments on it with his family and then in a hospital) determined that when people started using IBT their first thing in the morning urine's PH is highly acidic compared to sleeping horizontal. These same people measured slightly taller.

These person's heart rates decreased by around 10 BPM during inclined sleep and the respiration decreased by 4 to 5 breaths per minute, yet circulation and metabolism in all cases was higher in the "inclined" sleep than the horizontal sleep [position]

Unfortunately I cannot reproduce all of the article on it, but there are many websites on Inclined Bed Therapy you can Google.

Several People have shown that it is possible to reverse damage to the Central and Peripheral Nervous System including complete spinal cord injuries and nerve damage caused by progressive MS including damage to the optic nerve. Varicose veins. leg ulcers,edema (swelling), arthritic conditions, lethargy, muscle wastage (atrophy) and osteoporosis, have all responded well to this therapy.

Other conditions were lessened or eliminated entirely: acid reflux, arthritis, back pain, edema, MS, metabolic disorders, Parkinson's, and respiratory distress that included sleep apnea and snoring. Some of Uzzell's clients are pro athletes. When they began using IBT, he recalls, their coaches were "staggered" by their performance increase. "I was told not to spread the word too aggressively, since after all, people like their competitive advantage."

Some respond well to this therapy in four weeks while others may take four months or more. An improved resistance to infection has also been observed.

The article goes on and explains that the increased circulation even though the heart is working less hard, nutrient conveyance and waste removal are enhanced. also reduced compression on the spine allows the lymph tissue to move more freely and drain more easily. Also the fascia or membranes enveloping the muscles, unwind.

[TylerDurden]

Not logical, that claim re baking soda supposedly "debunking" anti-acid/alkali claims, the whole point is that the human body self-regulates its PH value. Anyway, like I said before, others such as Craig Bates found that the acid/alkali theory did not apply to their own bodies, so I can safely conclude that the acid/alkali theory is bogus, especially given  the scientific data debunking it.

[raw-al]

so I can safely conclude that the acid/alkali theory is bogus, along with the scientific data debunking it.

I know you didn't mean to say it but your grammar indicates that the the scientific data debunking it is bogus.

Freudian slip maybe.... just kidding.

[raw-al]

The acid alkaline thing seems to dovetail into Ayurveda. If I eat foods that are acidic I have serious issues.

However for some they are probably a good idea.

[goodsamaritan]

Personally I consider that Quackwatch is written by members of the "Worldwide Union of Allopathic Doctors and Drug Producers" for their own personal financial gain. They are willing to subsidize this website as it brings them money. No other way of putting it. They could give a sh*t about your health.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What he said above.
They do not give a shit about our health.
Quackwatch is written by members of the "Worldwide Union of Allopathic Doctors and Drug Producers" for their own personal financial gain.

---------

You can try putting Quackwatch to the test and ask them their opinion of the RawPaleoDietForum.com 

Betcha they'll say we are all a bunch of lying hoaxsters.

[Dorothy]

The entire paradigm is based not on health - but on sickness - on alleviating symptoms. People that can't think get caught up in it - but people that can't or don't want to think also can believe any alternative thing just because it's alternative and lose their ability to discern.

Right now the weights are heavier on the medical point of view - it has basically become an autocracy of health politically and financially - so in that sense that website is much more dangerous than any of the websites and alternative therapies it attacks..... but.... for people like us who can see through it and can think for ourselves it can be a useful tool. When reading it becomes obvious where they are reaching for something totally stupid to discredit and where there might be something of value to keep us from wasting our time. Take for instance acupuncture. When I read that one a while back he said that he felt his patients pulse and it was fine. This shows that he simply has no clue about what feeling the 12 pulses is about at all. He also talked about the danger of sticking in needles - which means that he probably has never experienced or maybe even seen an acupuncture needle. He could not bring forth any links about how acupuncture does not work and there have been countless experiments showing that it does - especially in China. There was nothing he could state that made any sense. But - there have been new alternative things I've gone to to research like the Hulda Clarke stuff that was useful to me. Sloan Kettering is the same - totally, absolutely tied into the big money trying to keep cancer a big money making business and to discredit any alternative therapy. Again, for the lame brain that can't think outside of this box at all it's a trap - but for the likes of us it's just a tool.

The real problem is not quackwatch - it's how the entire paradigm runs everything. Your insurance won't cover alternative therapies and alternative hospitals, the legal system is in total support of the paradigm, big pharma finances it all and we don't get a choice. There's no funding to test the alternative therapies and modern medicine is like getting trapped in a spider web. If you can stay out of the web and watch it for what it is, then all the websites and possibilities become assets.

[Dorothy]

Hey Al - the incline bed thing - it really is amazing. My body temperature at night and during the day has risen. My metabolism has risen. My urine in the morning is yellow and acidic when it normally is not. I can't stop drinking water, constantly, all day, non-stop. My kidneys are working hard getting rid of the gunk. At night my pulse might be lower but first thing in the morning it goes way up and I have too much energy to do my normal yoga and meditation - I've had to start taking to doing that another point in the day. Maybe it will all get slower later. During the day it is slower than normal. Right now I'm sitting in shorts. I'm usually never in shorts in the house because I'm always colder than my husband no matter what we have the thermostat set on. My normal body temperature has gone up at least half a point back to 98.4 like when I was young.

I can't find my ph test strips - darn! I sure would like to take my ph... just out of curiosity.

Miker - I'd like to throw something out to you. The fact that you don't burp might not be that the stomach is normally not acid in healthy people - it might be that you have an issue with stomach acid. People with health issues often have difficulty digesting because their stomach acid is off. They have to take hydrochloric acid supplements.

Tyler - in one of those links it said that acid/alkaline was from Dr. Young - but I met him when he was first starting out and acid/alkaline was around way before him. Also, I don't remember much if anything of that in any of his lecturing or his book at that time. Maybe he picked up on it later or something? But anyway - being concerned about ph wasn't his brain child that's for sure, so discrediting him didn't mean much really. People seem to like to blame him for just about everything. He really upset the mainstream. He would show blood analysis of bacteria and viruses changing back and forth - oh - they hated that! Also, just because different organs are different ph levels, the pancreas and all that jazz about it in the article - that doesn't mean much when talking bout the general over acidity or alkaline status of the body as a whole where the body has to dump lots of acid out the urine because there is generally more than useful in the entire body. I really don't think those links adequately dubunked anything either - but that doesn't mean to me that raw paleo people have to think much about acid/alkaline or that it is all that useful to us whether true or false.

This discernment stuff sure can make your brain hurt! I better go drink even MORE water!

[raw-al]

You can try putting Quackwatch to the test and ask them their opinion of the RawPaleoDietForum.com 

Betcha they'll say we are all a bunch of lying hoaxsters.

Amen, you said it bro!

[raw-al]

Hey Al - the incline bed thing - it really is amazing. My body temperature at night and during the day has risen. My metabolism has risen. My urine in the morning is yellow and acidic when it normally is not. I can't stop drinking water, constantly, all day, non-stop. My kidneys are working hard getting rid of the gunk. At night my pulse might be lower but first thing in the morning it goes way up and I have too much energy to do my normal yoga and meditation - I've had to start taking to doing that another point in the day. Maybe it will all get slower later. During the day it is slower than normal. Right now I'm sitting in shorts. I'm usually never in shorts in the house because I'm always colder than my husband no matter what we have the thermostat set on. My normal body temperature has gone up at least half a point back to 98.4 like when I was young.

I too seem to be able to drink a lot of water.

I notice that when I get out of bed my back feels a lot stronger. I don't feel at all bad sitting straight up, rather than rolling slightly to one side. It's if my back is stronger. I also feel more erect and solid when I walk.

On the IBT forums, people with MS, talk about warmer extremities, which is of course one of the problems with MS.

[Dorothy]

I too seem to be able to drink a lot of water.

I notice that when I get out of bed my back feels a lot stronger. I don't feel at all bad sitting straight up, rather than rolling slightly to one side. It's if my back is stronger. I also feel more erect and solid when I walk.

On the IBT forums, people with MS, talk about warmer extremities, which is of course one of the problems with MS.

I've been feeling myself walking straighter too! I noticed it yesterday.

[Dorothy]

Quote from: goodsamaritan on Yesterday at 08:26:49 pm
You can try putting Quackwatch to the test and ask them their opinion of the RawPaleoDietForum.com 

Betcha they'll say we are all a bunch of lying hoaxsters.

Amen, you said it bro!

Of course they would! What else would you expect? But what would they use as arguments? That's what would be interesting. Most of the arguments we have shown to be totally false just by the fact that we live and thrive on the diet and don't die horrible deaths from being poisoned.

If you have common sense - quackwatch is the quack. Anyone can say anything they like on the internet - that's the beauty of the internet! It's up to the reader to decipher what is likely hogwash and what isn't.

[Alive]

The internet feedback on inclined bed therapy is good and it is easy to block the bed up at the head, so I'll give it a go today, cheers raw-al.

I am also very interested in making a swinging bed, but its a little more difficult than a inclining your bed.
Recent studies have shown swinging / rocking is beneficial to sleep (rock-a-bye-baby):
http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/news/4433/need-a-nap-find-yourself-a-hammock

I have also found that sleeping in a gently rocking boat is very restful.

[raw-al]

Of course they would! What else would you expect? But what would they use as arguments? That's what would be interesting. Most of the arguments we have shown to be totally false just by the fact that we live and thrive on the diet and don't die horrible deaths from being poisoned.

If you have common sense - quackwatch is the quack. Anyone can say anything they like on the internet - that's the beauty of the internet! It's up to the reader to decipher what is likely hogwash and what isn't.

They would cite the litany of diseases, parasites etc. as what raw dieters are exposing themselves to.

I have a friend from China who says that back in China, due to 'night soil' they even cook lettuce because of parasites/disease.

Night soil is uncomposted fresh humanure from cities which is put into ponds and then spread on the fields at night.

Then they would find the youtube of the guy that someone posted here BTW, who started a raw diet to lash out at his family and after they lined him up with a shrink (idiot) and a nutritionist (idiot) they talked him out of risking his life.

Then they would scour the universe for anything, some guy from Tanganyika who ate a bug and died instantly or they would just make something up. Their stories are generally weak. Just something that maybe could be a bit true.

Remember they have a whole planet of subscribers in the allopathic union.

[Alive]

In the modern world its fine if most people die very slowly and sometimes painfully through bad diet, alcohol, pharmaceuticals, smoking etc - this is just normal life and happens gradually so we don't notice. At least they have paid heaps of taxes along the way, that's what really matters!

But if there are any random sudden deaths from an infection or accident then that is not OK, it happened fast enough for people to notice, and so we all need to eat cooked food to ensure that the odd person doesn't quickly drop dead. 'Microbes are the source of illness and cooking kills most microbes so it must be good. I'm a doctor / nutritionist / scientist, I have a university degree in health and I am really clever, I eat cooked food and in living memory my family ate cooked food, so it is normal to eat cooked food you idiots! (So what if my photo shows that I am grey, fat and wrinkly)'