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Offline Nora

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just joined, introducing myself
« on: December 31, 2012, 09:44:58 am »
Hi, my name is Nora and I live in Portland, Oregon. I finally joined this forum today after spending a lot of time reading on this forum over the last couple of weeks. I am fascinated and intrigued with the idea of "high meat", and I am here primarily to learn about that. I'm not sure of the difference between Primal & Paleo, but I think I may be Primal because I resonate most strongly with the ideas of Nora Gedgaudas and her book "Primal Body, Primal Mind".
I have tried many different ways of eating in my life (vegetarian, vegan, raw, organic, local, whole foods, etc.) and 2 years ago I was advised that I really must start eating meat on a regular basis in order to restore my health. I have severe adrenal fatigue, improper digestion, many food intolerances, and malfunctioning of my nervous system and my endocrine system and my brain. I also have severe mineral deficiencies and toxicity due to improper digestion due to eating so many foods that I am sensitive to. My health has finally begun to improve significantly in the last 1-2 months, after almost 2 years of following a Nutritional Balancing program based on hair mineral analysis (overseen by Dr. Lawrence Wilson).
I have not eaten grains, legumes or starches for about 20 months. My diet has been consisting of only organic food, mostly cooked vegetables, raw milk from which I make 24 hour yogurt and creme fraiche, 100% grass fed locally raised beef, duck, chicken, yak & buffalo, local pastured goose, duck & some chicken eggs, unsalted pastured Kerrygold butter, extra virgin olive oil, and sometimes a bit of raw honey that has never been heated at all. I have been making a lot of bone broths and using them on a daily basis, per the GAPS diet which I have been following for a close to 2 years, along with Primal eating and my Nutritional Balancing program. They all fit together or overlap very nicely. I also make all sorts of fermented vegetables and sauerkraut which are a consistent part of my diet.
I recently discovered Ajanous Vonderplanitz and have read about half of his two books. I started eating a little raw meat about 2 weeks ago and I think I notice benefits from it. I am fascinated with the idea of eating most or all of my animal products raw and particularly with the idea of eating high-meat. I cut up some 100% grass fed beef last night in little tiny pieces and put 2 quart mason jars of it (only 1/3 full) in the fridge last night and one pint jar on a shelf in the kitchen to try speeding up the process by doing some of it unrefrigerated. I am definitely scared about the possibility of ingesting parasites and harmful bacteria because I have been warned of the dangers of spoiled/rotten/contaminated meat my whole life and basically just accepted those concerns as fact. Now I am happy to be reconsidering those beliefs/assumptions and learning about the possible healing properties of raw and high meat. I will have plenty of questions along the way which I will post in the appropriate threads, or perhaps start a thread or two of my own. I love to challenge the accepted norms and beliefs and discover new possibilities in life. I have to admit I am still very squeamish about high meat, but I have developed a decent comfort level with raw muscle meat and also with making bone broth from chicken heads and chicken feet. I am also comfortable with eating organ meats, although I have yet to try them raw. I am thinking about taking up hunting so that I can feel confident about the quality of my meat and I am thinking I may start by hunting squirrels since that feels a little less intimidating than a having to deal with a large animal such as a deer while I am first getting started hunting.

CitrusHigh

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #1 on: December 31, 2012, 10:42:56 am »
Hi Nora, welcome, you're going to learn a lot here, and I'm sure we'll learn from you too!

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2012, 11:42:10 am »
Same here, welcome to the forum!

(The "primal" label seems to have been ripped off by cooked-palaeos like mark sissons, yet it was in use, years ago, by aajonus.)
« Last Edit: December 31, 2012, 11:47:56 am by TylerDurden »
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
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Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2012, 12:49:24 pm »
If you're still having food sensitivities, you may want to try tanning or vitamin D supplements.  vitamin D is good for calming an frantic immune response.  Eating high-fat and low carb is a good way to strengthen the effects of the vitamin D as well.  Some fatty fish has vitamin D in it as well.  I personally have seen a lot of my allergy problems reduced by taking vitamin D, as well as from sunbathing.

Offline Nora

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2012, 01:38:42 pm »
Good to know Cherimoya kid. I take Green Pasture's Blue Ice brand fermented cod liver oil regularly, which is supposed to have lots of Vitamin D3, A & K2 I believe, which are all supposed to work together. Also I made a big point of laying naked in the sun for a couple of hours on most sunny days we had last spring & summer. I'll do the same again this coming spring & summer.
Thanks to all of you who are welcoming me so enthusiastically!

Offline cherimoya_kid

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2013, 12:22:47 am »
Good to know Cherimoya kid. I take Green Pasture's Blue Ice brand fermented cod liver oil regularly, which is supposed to have lots of Vitamin D3, A & K2 I believe, which are all supposed to work together. Also I made a big point of laying naked in the sun for a couple of hours on most sunny days we had last spring & summer. I'll do the same again this coming spring & summer.
Thanks to all of you who are welcoming me so enthusiastically!

ROFL I've been to Portland.  You don't get anywhere NEAR enough UV radiation there, even on a totally sunny day at noon on the summer solstice, to actually produce enough vitamin D.  It's too far north, it's too cloudy, and it's too close to sea level.

You may not see much results from vitamin D supplements, but I'd try them.  the Now brand are the best I've tried.  The softgels work very well.  I would take a 1000 IU  softgel every day for about 5 days.  If you don't notice improvements, then you aren't deficient, probably.  Take it right before bed.  This is a much cheaper way to find out if you're deficient, than having blood work done.

Offline Iguana

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2013, 01:45:44 am »
Welcome !

With all due respect, I disagree with CK: I would never take any synthetic vitamins, just like I wouldn’t take any synthetic supplements. Vitamins in natural foods are embedded in extremely complex and diverse organic molecular structures, like minerals and trace elements. Synthetic vitamins are chemically pure, all same, and are thus certainly more or less noxious. The difference between them and the natural ones is like between refined pure white sucrose, which is harmful, and various sugars in honey, fruits or sugar cane.   

We don’t need pure chemical substances but minerals and trace elements included in living organisms, embedded in complex organic molecular structures.
I'm not especially a fan of Mercola, but I think he's absolutely right on this matter:
Quote
BEWARE of Most Prescription Vitamin D Supplements!

It is important to understand that the ideal and STRONGLY preferred method of increasing your vitamin D3 level is through appropriate sun exposure. I really do not advise oral supplements, not even cod liver oil now, UNLESS you can have your blood levels regularly monitored.

It just is too risky. I have seen too many potentially dangerous elevations of vitamin D levels, including my own, from those that are taking oral supplements.

But when you get your vitamin D from appropriate sun exposure your body can indeed self-regulate and greatly reduce vitamin D production if you don't need it, which makes it very difficult to overdose on vitamin D from sun exposure.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2013, 01:56:18 am by Iguana »
Cause and effect are distant in time and space in complex systems, while at the same time there’s a tendency to look for causes near the events sought to be explained. Time delays in feedback in systems result in the condition where the long-run response of a system to an action is often different from its short-run response. — Ronald J. Ziegler

Offline Adora

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2013, 04:52:07 am »
Hi Nora, and welcome.
    I've been eating high meat since last fall and it is one of the most significant factors in my healing yet. I want to encourage you to be brave.
    You only need a little. Watch Inger's you tube video. I eat as it gets high. I can taste the meat developing that way and it acclimates me to it. Open your jar and have a bite right now, before it tastes really strong. You will live and every day build courage and confidence. Remember to air it out every day. I stir mine while I taste each day and that way I put more in a jar, about 1/2 full. Eventually it smells so potent of ammonia I toss it, but I've tried it and it never made me the slightest bit sick, it's just past my level of palatability at this time. It didn't make me feel any better than regular high meat so it goes in compost at that point. Any meat that hasn't been frozen and starts to get old on me get chunked up and stuck in a jar so I rarely run out. If I have too many jars going I combine similar stages of even different meats. No problem with that either. I share the same fork for all of my jars and I lick them clean in between. You can PM me and I'll give you my number if you need more encouragement.

Merciola  has tons about how you need bacteria to use synthetic vit D.
know thyself and all of the mysteries of the gods and the universe will be revealed.
Oracle at Delphi

Then began I to thrive, and wisdom to get,
I grew and well I was;
Each word led me on to another word,
Each deed to another deed.
Odin, who chose to be weak and hang form the tree of the world (the universe), to capture the Runes (wisdom), so he (omnipotent) grew...
Each true word and deed leads to my manifestation of the true me.

Offline Nora

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2013, 05:56:30 am »
Hi Nora, and welcome.
    I've been eating high meat since last fall and it is one of the most significant factors in my healing yet. I want to encourage you to be brave.
    You only need a little. Watch Inger's you tube video. I eat as it gets high. I can taste the meat developing that way and it acclimates me to it. Open your jar and have a bite right now, before it tastes really strong. You will live and every day build courage and confidence. Remember to air it out every day. I stir mine while I taste each day and that way I put more in a jar, about 1/2 full. Eventually it smells so potent of ammonia I toss it, but I've tried it and it never made me the slightest bit sick, it's just past my level of palatability at this time. It didn't make me feel any better than regular high meat so it goes in compost at that point. Any meat that hasn't been frozen and starts to get old on me get chunked up and stuck in a jar so I rarely run out. If I have too many jars going I combine similar stages of even different meats. No problem with that either. I share the same fork for all of my jars and I lick them clean in between.

Wow thanks Adora, this is really helpful information and encouragement for me. If I come up with some specific questions I'll definitely keep in mind your offer to PM you. Thanks for suggesting that I try my high meat that I just started already at this early stage (only 2 days into it's fermentation, at room temp: 70°F). That is a great idea for how I can ease myself into eating it once it gets strongly fermented and slimy, which I fear at this point. I'm also glad to hear your experiences with stirring it when you air it out and using the same fork for all jars, etc. Those are the very kind of details that really feel helpful to me.
Would you mind sharing a bit about how high meat has been one of the most significant factors in your healing?
The thing that appeals to me most about what I've read about high meat is the way it affects people's mood. I have struggled with varying degrees of depression for most of my life, with  periods of greatly improved mood - just enough to have me realize what is possible. I also read that high meat can help with mental clarity. I have been feeling a significant amount of brain fog and lack of motivation and lack of physical energy. I'm not experiencing much digestive difficulty now that I have eliminated starches and sweet foods from my diet. Yesterday I read about dry aging my meat in my fridge and then I unwrapped the little bit of GF beef that I had and let it start to dry out a bit, then sliced it and let it dry out in the fridge a bit more overnight and have particularly enjoyed it this morning.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2013, 05:15:33 pm by TylerDurden »

Offline eveheart

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2013, 06:36:20 am »
I dry age beef and fish. I have my butcher cut me the whole GF beef muscle, such as eye of round, and I specify do not trim, otherwise they cut away the outer layer of the muscle with its fat and connective tissue. I find this layer prevents the muscle from drying out quickly. I'm still experimenting with the fish - mostly mackerel - but when I age the fish, it tastes incredibly good.

I got over the "I can't believe I'm eating this stuff" in my first few days of eating raw meats. I get a lot of inspiration from Korean and other Asian cuisine. For example, it was hard for me to eat raw crustaceans (crab, lobster) until I saw it served at a Korean buffet.

I'm glad to see you on this forum. I eat a very low-carb raw diet, and it has created a complete turnaround in my health.
"I intend to live forever; so far, so good." -Steven Wright, comedian

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2013, 06:45:02 am »
"High-meat" is the best for improving mood, energy-levels and alertness, due to the bacteria-content:-


http://discovermagazine.com/2007/jul/raw-data-is-dirt-the-new-prozac

Couple of cautions:- While some people do indeed find immediate relief after eating just a little piece of "high-meat", many others will  need larger sizes. For example, I found, ages ago when I first tried "high-meat", that I needed to eat at least 2 cubic inches of "high-meat" a day  in order to get a sizeable "buzz" therefrom. The "buzz" also took until the next day for it to start working on me.

One last thing:- I have not had any success in preparing "high-meat" from dry-aged meats. Best to stick with standard  wet raw meats.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

Offline Nora

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2013, 09:23:29 am »
Eve & Tyler, thanks for the additional information.
I just aired and tasted my 2 day fermented (@ 70° room temp.) GF beef! It definitely smells like it is beginning to ferment a bit. It smells like meat that I would have previously thought had gone bad and needed to be disposed of. With this whole new perspective about high-meat I was actually able to appreciate the smell of it in a new way and to my surprise I enjoyed the taste even more than the smell. Thinking of it like a ripe cheese helps me quite a bit. I am pleased to say that I think I'll be able to taste a bit of this every day as it ripens/matures to ease myself into eating high meat. I'm quite excited that I am able to tolerate this! Thanks so much for all the encouragement and ideas.

Offline Adora

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2013, 03:19:47 am »
Benefits I have personally enjoyed from high meat:
1. not dying when I  have been told I would makes me happy and more secure and trusting in my instincts and primal ways of natural health
2. feeling a little sharper,  more focused, and less depressed - although it is subtle not drug like. Its more like an after thought that I have been more alert or less depressed, and had increased ability to focus. Unlike a pill that has an observable effect in an hour. I don't eat much - maybe if I did it would be stronger
3. keeps my digestion regular. When I switch up my diet, or things are slow for any reason, I eat a little more and within and hour I have a BM -   :o
4. I have been able to binge heavily on sugary carbs - not proud but, I have fallen off the wagon too many times over the last year. Being a diabetic I have suffered horrible yeast infections in my past, but NEVER one, no matter how bad I have eaten, as long as I have been eating high meat. When I ran out and was eating badly I felt one coming on, but I made a quick batch and even though it wasn't fully high, it reversed all symptoms, without me improving my diet  -[ - that was also a very dark time emotionally, I was depressed at times. That I pulled myself out of it and returned to healthier diet and lifestyle choices, speaks to the power of holding onto the high meat, through it.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2013, 10:10:31 am by TylerDurden »
know thyself and all of the mysteries of the gods and the universe will be revealed.
Oracle at Delphi

Then began I to thrive, and wisdom to get,
I grew and well I was;
Each word led me on to another word,
Each deed to another deed.
Odin, who chose to be weak and hang form the tree of the world (the universe), to capture the Runes (wisdom), so he (omnipotent) grew...
Each true word and deed leads to my manifestation of the true me.

Offline screwnicolas

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2013, 04:03:47 pm »
Hello All, I joined today !

CitrusHigh

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2013, 03:33:33 am »
Haha, what's with your user name ScrewNicolas? Also, welcome!!

Offline Bacchal

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2013, 04:31:56 am »
Welcome, Nora. "Primal Body, Primal Mind" resonated with me as well when I first became interested in "primal eating." Would you happen to be the Nora that once frequented the VeggieBoards forum (although I think it may have been Nora with an "h")?

Offline Ioanna

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2013, 10:13:45 am »
"High-meat" is the best for improving mood, energy-levels and alertness, due to the bacteria-content:-


http://discovermagazine.com/2007/jul/raw-data-is-dirt-the-new-prozac

Couple of cautions:- While some people do indeed find immediate relief after eating just a little piece of "high-meat", many others will  need larger sizes. For example, I found, ages ago when I first tried "high-meat", that I needed to eat at least 2 cubic inches of "high-meat" a day  in order to get a sizeable "buzz" therefrom. The "buzz" also took until the next day for it to start working on me.

One last thing:- I have not had any success in preparing "high-meat" from dry-aged meats. Best to stick with standard  wet raw meats.

i've never gotten the 'buzz' or 'high' from high meat. assuming it's been prepared correctly, does that mean i just need to eat more?... i feel like i did eat a lot though.

Offline TylerDurden

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #17 on: February 08, 2013, 05:51:09 pm »
i've never gotten the 'buzz' or 'high' from high meat. assuming it's been prepared correctly, does that mean i just need to eat more?... i feel like i did eat a lot though.
PP is the only other one to mention not getting any benefit from "high-meat".  Have you tried eating several big mouthfuls of "high-meat" per day? Also my own experience was that I only experienced the benefits of "high-meat" the next day after eating them - no idea why, but you shouldn't perhaps expect instant results.
"During the last campaign I knew what was happening. You know, they mocked me for my foreign policy and they laughed at my monetary policy. No more. No more.
" Ron Paul.

CitrusHigh

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #18 on: February 08, 2013, 11:09:10 pm »
i've never gotten the 'buzz' or 'high' from high meat. assuming it's been prepared correctly, does that mean i just need to eat more?... i feel like i did eat a lot though.

You seem like a naturally cheery and content person Ioanna, it may be that people who's mood suffers more because of negative stimuli (processed foods, stress etc) notice more, the mood altering effects of high meat, due to the rule of relativity. The same way I don't really notice mood elevation from cannabis the way I used to when I was SAD because I'm so freaking happy all the time in spite of stimuli, thank you raw animal flesh. Just a possible theory, or could just be a variable built in biochemistry.

Offline Ioanna

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Re: just joined, introducing myself
« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2013, 09:53:15 am »
PP is the only other one to mention not getting any benefit from "high-meat".  Have you tried eating several big mouthfuls of "high-meat" per day? Also my own experience was that I only experienced the benefits of "high-meat" the next day after eating them - no idea why, but you shouldn't perhaps expect instant results.

not several big mouthfuls per day. i usually only eat at weekends. i can't tell if it's helping me or not though so i slack in preparing it.

You seem like a naturally cheery and content person Ioanna, it may be that people who's mood suffers more because of negative stimuli (processed foods, stress etc) notice more, the mood altering effects of high meat, due to the rule of relativity. The same way I don't really notice mood elevation from cannabis the way I used to when I was SAD because I'm so freaking happy all the time in spite of stimuli, thank you raw animal flesh. Just a possible theory, or could just be a variable built in biochemistry.

oh, that's a good point. if my mood were down, i might notice something more immediate. i'm kind of wired though, i was hoping for the 'high'  :D   also i was hoping for improvement digestion wise. sometimes my abdomen still feels a bit bloated which i think is bad gut flora?  so i've been keeping carbs low again and eating aged or high meats to try to get the balance back.

 

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