Why are people bashing Raw Paleo?

[PaleoPhil]

I agree 150%. I hope you didn't think for a second that I wouldn't.

[Poncho]

Just checking,
Gotta be sure that the ones with the knowledge arent also selfish.
Because that would really slow things down

[van]

haha maybe Im better in person, but it does work.

I figured out a while ago, that people suck.
I thought there was no hope for them, because no matter how much I talked to them, they didnt budge.
So I thought I hated them all, and that I will never fit into society again.
It was so miserable (I was also really fucked in the head and depressed)
I didnt know what to do.

Then the raw meat fixed me up even more,
I realized what I must do.

Learn as much as I can about raw pale,
and then argue with people until they are forced to see the truth.

It's worked.
I'm a really good arguer when I'm in my right mind, that might have something to do with it.
People also listen to me, and I dont mean that they actually take what Im saying seriously at first, but they do start and remain listening for some reason.

The system I've figured out kinda loosely works like this:

I study the target, I find their weaknesses, then I research how raw paleo will help specifically those problems.
Then I get into it with the target, I bring up raw paleo, we discuss the pros and cons,
then when they start showing a lot of resistance, I pull out their weaknesses that raw paleo will help with (which are all weaknesses)
They hate me for this, they get angry and eventually shut down.

Maybe in a few hours or days, they come back
with a slightly or substantially more open mind
they come with questions, but are sure to say things like "well I could do the vegetables, but NOT that meat! I just couldn't."
I inform and provide examples of my own progress, using my own body as a visual aid.

Then they come back again.
More open than the last time.

This is where I'm at with everyone I've been trying to teach so far (other than my nana, mom, and boyfriend who all eat raw paleo with me. I used my system on them too, they were the first ones. Well, not my nana, she never asked questions really.)

The progress is pretty undeniable.

It's to the point where I can pick out which stage I'm at with each person, because the same lines are used by everyone.
It's like everyone here is programmed the exact same.
I'll let you know how it goes

Poncho, did you ever stop and think that it was because you had hit rock bottom with your condition that that was why you opened yourself to raw paleo?  That happens to most,,,out of desperation people then become willing to do something different, to go against their grain. 
   Your method that you describe,,  You might see if when you're in the midst of your persuasion,, where's your heart?  Are you trying to convince the other from your head, or do you really feel their heart and moment by moment truly care for them.  Ultimately we're all here not to find raw paleo or any other diet, but to share in the joy of love.  Don't want to sound preachy, but I see that as your real opportunity in sharing what you now know with others.  For if you are successful,  then they will be able come from their heart in sharing with those that they meet and want to help. 

[svrn]

i look so healthy now that people dont believe that i used be sick all the time looked like it. They think im lying about it or just made it up.

even people who would see me vomiting for no reason and covered in acne and generally sick all the time now also think it never happened an that i was just always healthy and its all in my head.

it just means that lots of people will simply think what they are supposed to no matter what.

its like when i told people years before the economy started to even go bad that we were going to hit a depression and now all those people that i know i told that to say that i never said that before it happened. their brainwashing simply erased their memory of me saying that.

[TylerDurden]

i look so healthy now that people dont believe that i used be sick all the time looked like it. They think im lying about it or just made it up.

even people who would see me vomiting for no reason and covered in acne and generally sick all the time now also think it never happened an that i was just always healthy and its all in my head.

Yes, similiar stuff has happened to me, too. really frustrating when people pretend that you were never ill.

[Wai Kai Zen]

Poncho,
Dont you know anyone who has been thriving on a cooked diet?
I think its easy to forget that not everyone is sick and going to die because of it.
I know quite some people who have lived untill their 90s and have been healthy and happy.. on a cooked diet.
They did not need any medication or whatever.

I feel like whats wrong with todays people is that they take alot of drugs and alcohol and processed foods with sugars and fats and dont even make a connection between that and their sickness.
I have NEVER in my life seen someone eat raw meat.. let alone raw high meat.. thats just not for me.
One of the biggest promotors of raw paleo is aajonus vonderplanitz and he does not look super healthy to me.

So.. taking all this into account I dont find it weird that people bash raw paleo.. I dont blame them either.
If you want to "convince" people.. then lead by example as some have already suggested.. become living proof. Make people jealous of your radiant health, that will convince them.
I wouldnt listen to a dietician who is fat and has the worst skin ever, thats not weird to understand.


I want to make clear that I have seen benefits from some parts of this diet (raw egg yolks are awesome, thanks GS, I will keep on thanking you) and raw fats aswell. It helped me immediately and in so many ways.

I understand your intentions and I dont think its bad, but remember that alot of raw vegans have the same intentions and seem to think to have found the truth.
People claiming to have the truth, I would be ware of them.. unless they have the looks and energy that I envy.. and keep this for over 10 years.

Dont get me wrong, I used to want to convince people aswell and thinking Ive found it.. I did it as a vegan, I did it on cooked paleo and I did it on raw paleo.. and right now Im thinking of a combi between cooked and raw paleo. Still.. now I question my own thoughts and theory and hope that others can enlighten me with their experience. I try to learn and keep my options open to try new things.

 

[Iguana]

See the photos here: http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/instinctoanopsology/what-do-raw-paleo-children-prefer/msg66466/#msg66466

[eveheart]

I know quite some people who have lived untill their 90s and have been healthy and happy.. on a cooked diet.
They did not need any medication or whatever.

Statistically (in the US), the vast majority of people over 50 are sick enough to have consulted a physician and take medications regularly. Perhaps this is different in your country, or perhaps you are saying that living to 90 implies good health. Whatever your motive in vindicating cooked foods, you can't refute the ancestral health record: modern-day diseases did not appear in mankind until the advent of cooking, agriculture, and domestication. Even short-term surveys implicate the modern (cooked, processed) diet as the cause of most disease.

You cannot convince me that a ticking time bomb is safe and harmless.

[Poncho]

You cannot convince me that a ticking time bomb is safe and harmless.

Perfectly put.

[Poncho]

Poncho, did you ever stop and think that it was because you had hit rock bottom with your condition that that was why you opened yourself to raw paleo?  That happens to most,,,out of desperation people then become willing to do something different, to go against their grain. 
   Your method that you describe,,  You might see if when you're in the midst of your persuasion,, where's your heart?  Are you trying to convince the other from your head, or do you really feel their heart and moment by moment truly care for them.  Ultimately we're all here not to find raw paleo or any other diet, but to share in the joy of love.  Don't want to sound preachy, but I see that as your real opportunity in sharing what you now know with others.  For if you are successful,  then they will be able come from their heart in sharing with those that they meet and want to help.

Did I ever stop to think about the obvious?
I have NO interest in your demeaning assumptions.
Have a good day

[Poncho]

Yes, similiar stuff has happened to me, too. really frustrating when people pretend that you were never ill.

Thats what it's like to recover from a brain injury. It doesn't get better, but I do.

[Wai Kai Zen]

Statistically (in the US), the vast majority of people over 50 are sick enough to have consulted a physician and take medications regularly. Perhaps this is different in your country, or perhaps you are saying that living to 90 implies good health. Whatever your motive in vindicating cooked foods, you can't refute the ancestral health record: modern-day diseases did not appear in mankind until the advent of cooking, agriculture, and domestication. Even short-term surveys implicate the modern (cooked, processed) diet as the cause of most disease.

You cannot convince me that a ticking time bomb is safe and harmless.

I agree with the processed food. Didnt I say that in my last post?
Also I stated that there is power in raw food for healing the diseases created by processed junk food.
Think about:
-Sugar.
-Salt.
-Vegetable oils.
-Radiation.
-Chemichals.
-Alcohol.
-Drugs.
-"Medicine".
-Make up.
-Deodorant.
-Gasses from cars and factories.
-Dairy.
-Grains.
-Caffeine.
And the list goes on...

And very important; the lack of the right nutrients in eggs and meats.
Dont forget that people tend to stay away from red meat and eggs, cooked AND raw.
No healthy foods for the immune system.

Im still experimenting and searching, sure, but I think at this moment in time.. I know too much people who are thriving on a cooked diet, to totally deny the option. I think its dangerous to become a radical on anything, thats why I made the connection with these vegans who stopped eating processed food, salt and get rid off toxins and pick up on exercise. They seem to have found the truth, while years later its clear that they are missing out on essential vitamins and minerals from animal foods. But they are so stuck on the fact that theyve "healed", that they wont try animal foods and just take supplements, because of lack of vitamins in the soil (whatever they got that from  ).

Well, to sum it up:
Convince people with your bloodwork and your ripped physique and healthy eyes and skin. Especially the bloodwork is important in this. If this is looking "perfect" than you will attract people who are sick and in need of help. You could help them. Stay happy and in balance and come from a place of love, like Van said.

Oh and Poncho, You seem to be very irritated to everyone who has another opinion than you, whether its diet or your approach of helping people. Others have the right to their opinions and mistakes just as much as you do.
We are all here to learn from eachother and sharing experiences and opinions are a part of this. A little respect, even if you totally disagree, would be in its place. I am referring to a comment that you made to for example Van or Bookittyrun.

[eveheart]

Kaizen: I am including cooking as a form of food processing. Heat radically changes the form and content of the macronutrients and micronutrients in all foods.

[Wai Kai Zen]

Kaizen: I am including cooking as a form of food processing. Heat radically changes the form and content of the macronutrients and micronutrients in all foods.

I know . But Im not sure of that. Just like Im not sure about the fact that parasites might be a good thing. Or eating meat filled with bacteria would be good. Im not saying a resounding never, but as of now I wont be trying that any time soon. I do, however, try raw meat and fish aswell.

As there is data to cooked meat being bad for you, there is also data about cooked meat making us human. So.. its just the data anyone wishes to believe. Just like vegans report that meat in general is dangerous, they seem to have data for that aswell.

Maybe you are right Eveheart and that is why Im experimenting with raw meat, but I will not condemn cooked meat just yet.

[Poncho]

Here let me help you out here

I have very compromised digestion
If I eat cooked meat, I get sick and bloated, I get rage that cannot be tamed, its insane haha
If I eat raw meat, I feel better and better each time.

This is consistent and 100%

If you are a thinker, you'll conclude that the raw meat vs cooked meat concept may have some ground. and therefore deserves some reconsideration on your part.

[Poncho]

our need for cooked meat is nothing more than an addiction

[Wai Kai Zen]

Here let me help you out here

I have very compromised digestion
If I eat cooked meat, I get sick and bloated, I get rage that cannot be tamed, its insane haha
If I eat raw meat, I feel better and better each time.

This is consistent and 100%

If you are a thinker, you'll conclude that the raw meat vs cooked meat concept may have some ground. and therefore deserves some reconsideration on your part.

I wont deny that this is what you experience and I am, truly, happy for you .
Id say, go on what makes you feel best.
Consider that what you described at what you experience as rage and bloating, might have another cause that only you have. Not everyone in the world. Or does everyone you know get bloated and rage after eating cooked meat?

Im not sure, but it might be a case of candida that you have. Taking some organic garlic (sauce) with it might definetly do the trick of relieving the bloating.

I do consider raw, as I mentioned before a couple of times. Im just not falling into the trap of totally condemning everything else.

[Iguana]

Kaizen: I am including cooking as a form of food processing. Heat radically changes the form and content of the macronutrients and micronutrients in all foods.

And generates abnormal molecules (new chemical species), many of which are noxious, some of them slowly and gradually accumulating in the body.

Kaizen, once again, the destruction of nutrients by heat is a very minor problem compared to the production of dangerous substances.  Destroyed nutrients don't just mysteriously disappear without traces: they are transformed into something else.

There's no special "power" in raw food, because it's our normal fuel (none would say that there is a "special power" in diesel fuel when poured it in the tank of a diesel vehicle  ). Healing may spontaneously occur when the cause of disease (in most cases, junk food and drinks, cooked food, dairy and grain) is removed.

"I know too much people who are thriving on a cooked diet (...)"  Yes, me too. Some will be lucky enough to remain in good health till they quietly die in their sleep at an advanced age, but "years later its clear most" get  painful disease(s) due to the accumulation of toxic molecules in their bodies. Many of those I had known in apparently fine health died of  illness or are now seriously ill, including some family members and friends. 

But no doubt that a partly cooked paleo diet (excluding dairy and wheat) is better than a standard western diet, as proved with more than 1000 volunteers by Seignalet at Montpellier. Just found this link about his experiments : http://paleozonenutrition.com/2011/04/01/dr-jean-seignalet-ancestral-diet-and-auto-immune-disease-trials/ 

[Wai Kai Zen]

Hi Iguana

I consider everything you say and agree with most of it!
You have been in this lifestyle long enough, so I will have to ask.. can you show me examples of people who have been eating raw meat over 10 or 15 years (or even better 40/50 years) ?
Show me as many as you can and maybe even point out what makes them look or feel healthier than the healthiest person on a cooked diet.

Its just that everyone I google or look up on youtube that eat raw meat.. doesnt look that healthy or fit to me. Just like raw vegans dont look that healthy to me. The girls Im attracted to eat alot of meat and vegetables.. cooked paleo kind of girls.

It would help out alot to see it on the outside that a person is healthy.

I do like the way you conversate Iguana, even tho we might disagree on some subjects. Your critique makes me think over alot of things and u dont seem to mind someone like me who is asking alot of questions. Its all out of interest and not plain old bitchin  .

[Iguana]

Thanks!

I can show you (below - the line on his face is the shadow of a cloth's line) a photo taken 3 years ago of GCB, born in 1934.

The persons I know, mostly in Switzerland, who have been eating “instincto” for several decades (some since the 60’s) age quite slower and better than most others. What strikes me most is that women remain nice-looking and attractive till an advanced age. I ain’t got any photo of them, though.

Have you seen the 4 photos I linked in an above post: http://www.rawpaleodietforum.com/instinctoanopsology/what-do-raw-paleo-children-prefer/msg66466/#msg66466

[TylerDurden]

Iguana has been doing the diet for 2 decades and a half. Others, like Aajonus, have done far more than that.

[TylerDurden]

Photos of course are a complete waste of time as they are so deceptive, re lighting, photoshopping etc.  I've seen cooked diet gurus look great on public photos, only to hear from others how truly sickly they actually looked in private.

[Wai Kai Zen]

He does look good for his age .
The young boys look good aswell.

So thank you for posting these pictures! 

To go on about cooked meats...
What signs would implicate that toxins of cooked meat are accumulating in the body? Whether its seen on the outside or felt on the inside?

And.. if these toxins indeed do accumulate, would it be accurate to say that raw egg yolks are a good way to get rid off these toxins?

[Iguana]

The accumulation of toxins is a logical inference and it can be clearly seen, for example in cellulite, and also smell. People often stink, and the older they get the more they may stink. An odor is due to some molecules in the air. Thus, if someone is polluting the ambient air, it certainly means that his/her body is saturated with malodorant molecules and if  we perceive a substance as stinking, it means it's noxious.

Cannibals would certainly and wisely refrain from eating a stinking person!   
 

[TylerDurden]

It's easy to spot the signs of heat-created toxins from cooked foods harming the body. One only has to look at signs of increased aging such as cellulite, sagging skin etc. etc. Heat-created toxins are heavily implicated in accelerated aging.