Twelve Tribes Of Israel

[raw-al]

Earlier this year we stumbled on the group http://twelvetribes.org/ and have become totally charmed by them. The ones locally have a farm that 30 people live in. They have cows, goats, chickens, bees and a large vege garden and greenhouse etc. They also have a restaurant in the town to provide additional income.

They are a commune and everyone works at what they are needed for, or are capable of doing. Since there are 30 or 40 groups of them all over the world, some of the people travel to different locations to help with setting up whatever their specialty is.

When you move there you basically give your possessions to the group and everything (except wives) are shared.
We were very tempted to move there.

They practice a form of Christianity that seems to me like the Essenes. There is no hierarchy although there are people in charge of different tasks so that things can run smoothly. They practice Christianity in a very gentle way and the people are uber friendly. The children are very sweet.

They live in nice buildings that they built and their common areas are very nicely built. They have rules but it is  very easy going place, not like a bunch of wild hippies. There are 3 generations of people living there and a bit of changeover as people can move to other communes in their system all over the world.

We have gone to their Friday night celebration a couple of times and love to visit.

Regarding food, they do buy a bit of food at this point such as fish but primarily produce their own.

[jessica]

their hierarchy is the dollar bill.  they have a pretty big presence in my hometown, and while I agree that they attract some pretty interesting people, I would be aware that they also attract people who hold a lot of guilt and shame.  they work their people pretty hard, especially if you ever work at the café, they keep them hoped up on mate, which I am convinced eventually wears them down, especially in the thyroid.  their women and children are subservient, but that's Christianity for you, it feeds into the guilt/shame cycle.

they do have excellent crafts people and it would be a good community to join to learn skills, but realize you are also taking on all of their beliefs, they will even limit what you are influenced by.  they do not take kindly to most who leave the tribe.

[bookittyrun]

it sounds like you are pretty enamoured by the group...  if religion is your thing, then go for it.  good morals and values are interpretive, and your personal definition of wholesome living practices can be achieved without having to subject yourself to the viewpoint of someone else.  christianity is a lifestyle, not a means of living.  talk it over with your family, before making a decision to join.  be wary, that groups seeking enrollment usually look good to outsiders, those who join may be personality types who have difficulty being self sufficient, and are not necessarily good people you'd want to associate with.  but without knowing you, it's tough to say whether or not this would be a good fit.  why not seek a group / community that places no emphasis on religious practice and belief, if your goal is to live in a self sustainability setting?

my personal feeling (after being raised as a child in a church / christian setting) is:  religion is for people who can't make up their own minds. 

but that's not to say it's a "bad" thing...  it's just not for me.  just make sure, if you decide to join, that it is the right thing for you (and your loved ones).

[raw-al]

their hierarchy is the dollar bill.  they have a pretty big presence in my hometown, and while I agree that they attract some pretty interesting people, I would be aware that they also attract people who hold a lot of guilt and shame.  they work their people pretty hard, especially if you ever work at the café, they keep them hoped up on mate, which I am convinced eventually wears them down, especially in the thyroid.  their women and children are subservient, but that's Christianity for you, it feeds into the guilt/shame cycle.

they do have excellent crafts people and it would be a good community to join to learn skills, but realize you are also taking on all of their beliefs, they will even limit what you are influenced by.  they do not take kindly to most who leave the tribe.

I didn't notice any dark side but of course maybe I didn't look deeply enough. That is my weakness.

[raw-al]

it sounds like you are pretty enamoured by the group...  if religion is your thing, then go for it.  good morals and values are interpretive, and your personal definition of wholesome living practices can be achieved without having to subject yourself to the viewpoint of someone else.  christianity is a lifestyle, not a means of living.  talk it over with your family, before making a decision to join.  be wary, that groups seeking enrollment usually look good to outsiders, those who join may be personality types who have difficulty being self sufficient, and are not necessarily good people you'd want to associate with.  but without knowing you, it's tough to say whether or not this would be a good fit.  why not seek a group / community that places no emphasis on religious practice and belief, if your goal is to live in a self sustainability setting?

my personal feeling (after being raised as a child in a church / christian setting) is:  religion is for people who can't make up their own minds. 

but that's not to say it's a "bad" thing...  it's just not for me.  just make sure, if you decide to join, that it is the right thing for you (and your loved ones).

Thoughtful.

I was very enamoured by the group. I was raised as a Christian but it was more a case of "if you don't go to Sunday School you can't go out and play." I hated it with a passion.

I cannot see myself really joining as I am not ready for the Christianity part and the problem is that if you join you cannot really leave as you have given away your lifeboat. However the place was very peaceful and happy. Not like the "Stepford Wives" but a genuine bliss.

BTW the Christian part was not offensive. It was not like they were shoving anything down your throat. As I mentioned before, it was more like the Essenes. They live like the original group of Christians that supposedly buried all the scrolls. They walk the talk. They were not looking for donations, but everyone kept the place afloat by genuinely stepping up to the plate to do what had to be done, just like we all do in our lives. Honestly it seemed to me the perfect way to live.

I have my spiritual practice and have no desire to change.

Nowadays in society we have our little castles and we hire people to do what we are incapable of. We've lost sight of working with our neighbours for the common good. I don't mean that I have no friends who I help and who help me but this is a whole community who work together to feed one another. If a young woman in the 'real' world has children and no employment and she loses her husband, she is up the creek, but in a place like this she is safe. It's like insurance.

I spoke with the apparent leaders and they explained how they have morphed and gradually found the formula to keep everyone happy which as you can imagine is not easy. It cannot be easy keeping the boat on an even keel. They said they shared everything but their wives. : )

In Sanskrit there is a word that is the root of the English word satisfied. Sattvik means happy in a peaceful, powerful, gentle, non-judgemental way. These people seemed sattvik.

[bookittyrun]

"Honestly it seemed to me the perfect way to live."

then this may be the right thing for you to pursue...

"I have my spiritual practice and have no desire to change."

this is good to hear...

i'm not sure about "stepford wives", i have no idea what that is...  actually, what came to mind was that movie a few years ago, with the blind girl going through the woods for medicine, and the elders who wore the costumes in the woods to scare commune members into the lifestyle...  stupid, silly movie...     

allow your personal convictions to help guide you.  after all, if this wasn't a good lifestyle option for some people, there would be no "group"... 

best wishes!

[raw-al]

The Stepford Wives was a completely forgettable feminist rag about a community where men had somehow modified their wives with some sort of bio-magic so they were perfect wives. Always smiling, great sex at any time, always happy, no complaining. The women had all previously been very successful CEOs, judges, you name it. It was a total feminist flight of fancy.
The girl in black that you see here represents all of the women that are destroyed by men in the prime of their careers and she goes on a mission to free these poor wives.

If you haven't seen it you are further ahead and I'd keep it that way. The trailer is bad enough.
Stepford Wives - trailer

Re the community. My wife and I had discussed along with other friends setting up a community more or less in the country where we would all live close, so we could meditate together.

Our point of view is that consciousness is a field, in the same way that magnetism etc are fields. When you gather people together to meditate it creates a field that basically pervades everything in it's vicinity and the more people the larger and stronger the field created. Then the old saying about "all boats rise with the tide" comes into play, in other words it raises everyone's consciousness naturally. Our community has a number of people who are in various stages of higher states so the theory seems to have validity.

In fact there are various versions of communities around. There are also communities where people who like airplanes live around an airport, with the streets as taxiways for aircraft as well as cars, as well as people who love boating etc who do the same.

[Dr. D]

I cant help but question the name and wonder, do they practice messianic Judaism? As in, Sabbath, kosher but also believe in Christ as messiah?

[Aura]

Hi,
I personally visited a TT community here in Brazil, Londrina.
They are not what they say on the international website.
It was a very disappointing experience for me.

What they do is not teaching rather trying to brainwash you and their mentality is sectarian.
And it is a very poor way of doing it..

I thought (from what I read on the international website) they were kind of anarchists, rejecting the system and the false laws of men but to me they seemed just like any other  person from "the world" and actually, they do serve "the world" by working pretty hard in the bakery and restaurants they run to the point of skipping the shabbath..

I studied orthodox judaism and TT of Londrina people know very little (or nothing) about kosher, mitzvot, the tefilah etc..
What they preach - in my opinion - cannot be defined as messianic judaism because they are not jews.
I do not have a term right now. Maybe I'll think about it.

[Brad462]

From what I understand Israel is simply a code word meaning those who wish to return to god.  In other words everyone is from the tribe of Israel.

[Brad462]

their hierarchy is the dollar bill.  they have a pretty big presence in my hometown, and while I agree that they attract some pretty interesting people, I would be aware that they also attract people who hold a lot of guilt and shame.  they work their people pretty hard, especially if you ever work at the café, they keep them hoped up on mate, which I am convinced eventually wears them down, especially in the thyroid.  their women and children are subservient, but that's Christianity for you, it feeds into the guilt/shame cycle.

I think you are confusing Christianity with the ego.  For some people diet is a religion...I won't mention any names.

[bookittyrun]

raw al:  you know, i like your concept for a community, better than the above mentioned "12 tribes" model...  why not just roll with that? 

you could recruit me...     

living here in florida, there are lots of communities that are themed around certain lifestyles...  there's an "airplane" community a few miles down the road, dozens and dozens of "golf" communities, "tennis" communities, "boating" communities, "elite shopping" communities, it's kinda crazy...  personally, i don't feel the need to be identified like that...

[jessica]

i am not saying the folks in their community are not charming, nor are they lacking useful skills.  I think that, unless you are 100% down with their religion and also willing to work within their hierarchy(how do you think they have all of these amazing properties, buildings, cafes, boats, properties, they also have other outside businesses) they will ask you to get rid of all of your personal possessions and also contribute your money to them.  you wont be allowed to learn or read freely.  most of the first time recruits I have seen get worked in their cafes, which are open 24 hours a day, so over night and extremely long shifts are not uncommon, and burnt out newbies are to be expected.  i think it takes a very strong and special individual to be a part of their group and maintain individual spirituality and identity, those people usually move on.

 I grew up around these guys, have friends with family in the tribe, have friends who have been in the tribe, have friends who have been out of the tribe, drank their mate, gone to holy mackerel Friday, gone to weddings....etc.  I have seen both good and bad, but to me the bad FAR FAR outweighs the good.

I have seen this communal thing work, and be extremely legit, and totally open to all benevolent spiritual pursuits, where familys can be their own contributing unit within a much larger community.  that is at sunrise ranch in Longmont Colorado.  those guys really have it together, have a beautiful piece of land, huge, well built facilities and very nice community and non community houses.  they host all kinds of amazing music, classes, seminars, lectures, art and yoga work shops have full commercial kitchens, sauanas, concert facilities.  they are not spaced out hippies by any means, are totally off the grid because they have an amazing network of solar and hydropower electricians within their community, they grow all of their own food including grass fed meats, do all kinds of nutritional healing workshops.  they are a much better example, a shining one in my eyes, you might want to check them out.  the guy who is in charge of organizing and overseeing the ranch is such a dear sweet man, i have been in communication with him over the years, hes actually really helped me out at times, and i was offered a pretty sweet position working for them.  i honestly was at a very bad place at that time and didn't want to spread it, or i would probably be living and working their to this day!   they don't ask you ascribe to anything, or loose your individuality, they respect personal space and lives as long as you are contributing positively. 

anyway, you have my input from my first hand experience with the tribe.

@bookitty: lol!

[Aura]

From what I understand Israel is simply a code word meaning those who wish to return to god.  In other words everyone is from the tribe of Israel.

That's right.
 

[Aura]

Raw al: How do you think you are going to keep a raw paleo diet in a TT community?
I remember everybody watching at me very weird when I would eat raw yolks and 10 bananas for breakfast..

Plus, they did not seem particularly health conscious as well.
They were eating burnt food items and when I addressed that, they told me their major focus is on their god and not health (while on their int. website they do talk about health and healthy foods, even mention raw sometimes..)
Which makes completely no sense to me and I just cannot accept that.
So they tried to make me feel selfish because I did not want to eat overcooked-burnt food but my mindset and my heart and my body havegot no place left for this crap, really..

[Inger]

Raw al: How do you think you are going to keep a raw paleo diet in a TT community?
I remember everybody watching at me very weird when I would eat raw yolks and 10 bananas for breakfast..

Plus, they did not seem particularly health conscious as well.
They were eating burnt food items and when I addressed that, they told me their major focus is on their god and not health (while on their int. website they do talk about health and healthy foods, even mention raw sometimes..)
Which makes completely no sense to me and I just cannot accept that.
So they tried to make me feel selfish because I did not want to eat overcooked-burnt food but my mindset and my heart and my body havegot no place left for this crap, really..

Hmmm... sounds a bit like my family that are very religious Christians.. following the Bible to a letter (they think so). I have no place left for their ambivalence either. Look;

One day my brother refused to try a tea I brewed, it was Yogi tea, very delicious actually. He said the tea will give you bad spirits. I said, heh? How can a tea make you sinful? Just natural herbs?

Next day, I joke when I put the ice cream on the table as they want to eat it with the blueberries. I say, okay, here comes the poison  (it was a quite bad ice cream with lots of sugar and additives, crap.. there are better ones out there). He then says to me, loud, I fully believe in the bible that says, not what gets into your mouth makes you sinful, but what comes out from it!

I later thought about it.. why did he said that about my healthy tea, then? I later said it too.. that it is a lie, and then it must always count. Oh my I am so ready to leave here.. to live in such ambivalence for so long is very exhausting. And man they are holy. Holier than every other so they are allowed to sit and speak bad stuff about other as much as they want. Huh? I can tell you I have those religious people pretty much in my throat.  To meat normal people that are real is a relief. Not living with two different faces... and instead of resolving issues.. just pushing them under the blanket.. and thinking I am saved. Oh man the other ones are the bad.. sure, they have no holy spirit, they can not see. Stupid they are. They do not belong to our church. Ok, who cares, in our church are only 5 adults and one kid (family) but we are the one that knows the truth. Only we. holy God please give the others the punishment they deserve.. I can help you a little with the punishment BTW. Oh yay how good it feels to use POWER..grrr huh. I am getting you all on your knees for sure. You have to obey me because I am Godsend.

Oh, and they try to make me feel selfish too. Like, I am living myself, and that is a bad thing. I do not care on bit though. But healthy it is not.
As teens we had to go out and work early and give all the money to our parents. then you was a great kid. God loved you. Sure, always when you obeyed them you was loved from God and when not you was doomed to burn in hell. HA This had to continue the whole life, even as an adult. Of course, the dad was the pastor in the Curch.. always have to obey him.
And all the way.. having this sweet smile on their face.. so everyone on the outside that do not know, thinks.. AH.. what amazing nice people.
Right now they are singing downstairs and playing piano. It is all so weird. So very weird.

In the end all you crave is reality. Anything is good, it just have to be REAL.

[Inger]

I apologize for the bad bad post above..  but sometimes it just have to come out. Maybe it can help people be careful to join communities, and really check if they are healthy first.
I have burned my fingers for sure, pretty scared to be involved in any of that stuff!

And sure, I still love my family, and I guess something is wrong with the brain that is why it is like that. So maybe they really cannot be otherwise. If they cannot think well or something. I am pretty sure there must be something wrong with the brainpower. 

[Dr. D]

I know what you mean as I have lived it and done it my whole life, Inger. this idea that the Christian/holy/spiritual life is an exclusive club is so off puttingand degrading it sickens most of us. Some people feel important being a part of an exclusive club like that, whereas the Jesus I know was inclusive.

My personal opinion on places like TT, they look good preaching community, but demand accountability before extending acceptance. They preach it in the name of Jesus but Jesus was always accepting and never exclusive. Yes he had his closest disciples, but there were large crowds following him roam.

To be honest about TT, it sounds like a cult, indoctrinating and enslaving people making them think they are enjoying the current suffering in hopes of better days.

[bookittyrun]

"I apologize for the bad bad post above..  but sometimes it just have to come out."

inger, the way i see it, this was the "bad bad post..."  you should never recant your personal feelings, and you should always feel free to express yourself, without fear of judgement, or persecution...  being able to express your heart and soul, the feelings and emotions that make you an individual (not one of the mindless, churchgoing masses...) is the very thing that creates your "being"... 

bravo for "letting it come out"...  never feel bashful.  the time will come when you can live free, as "you".  these trials with your family are to strengthen you and your spirit, until such time when you can set forth on your own path.  there is no shame in being an independent thinker...

[bookittyrun]

back on track...

there are some people who do well within this type of "structured" lifestyle, the same way that some people thrive in a military type environment, or even those who do well in a prison setting.  more-so than the goal of getting to heaven (or wherever the end leads...), religion commonly establishes a manner of living that promotes harmony within a group.  having established "roles" to fulfil, whether viewed as subservient or belittling, allows for each person within a group to perform certain tasks, with the goal of seamless coexistence within the group.  everyone who willingly participates, does so because they believe it is the correct course of action.  blaming a situation for discontentment is an excuse for something deeper, everyone has the option to leave.  as far as how the tribe views those who leaves...  who cares?  chances are good, that if someone opts out of the community, there is no desire to return.  life moves forward for them.  finding that communal group that allows an individual to thrive on a personal level is part of what life's journey is all about.  if living a religious lifestyle, or being in a controlled situation, allows for self contentment, then fine, it is for them.  i would never last more than 36 hours in any branch of the military, nor would i tolerate prison, just the same way i disbanded from my family's religion years ago.  my independent spirit allows me to live in relative solitude quite comfortably, and the strength i've gained from efforts of self betterment and personal growth allows my heart and soul to flourish in a way it never did while following "god's word".  there is no one else quite like me, i am unique...  i am an individual, and i continue to improve myself on a daily basis.  i am not limited by "holy doctrine", and i refuse to be tied down with the restraints of church.  i choose to be myself, which i feel is a beautiful, and spiritually fulfilling endeavor... 

realizing that i am an individual, allows me to understand that what works for me, is not what works for everyone else...  if the 12 tribes model allows for others to live harmoniously, then awesome... 

[jessica]

.  blaming a situation for discontentment is an excuse for something deeper

everyone has the option to leave.  as far as how the tribe views those who leaves...  who cares? 

yep, just like becoming par of a communal  religious tribe and having that be their identity and a separating and sheltering factor and that this is a external modification to aliviate a internal crisis is often the cause for many to join..........

I view their excommunication as a reflection of intolerance and just negative human behavior.  if they were truly non judgmental it wouldn't matter and someone would always be considered family, I have seen this not be the case.

any how let us know how it goes, it might be for you, it might be healthy for you, I don't know that, I am just giving you my perspective after spending years around the tribe.  they are actually the only place that has sold me meat rancid enough to turn my stomach, ha!  faulty refrigeration and well, they just try to squeeze every bit of money out of things they can. 

just check out sunrise ranch if you get a chance.  I have seen so many examples of communal living in my life, and these guys have it together.  plus they raise their own grassfed meat, if you wanted real health and healing advocates, you will find them here!

[raw-al]

Jessica,
Interesting reply. The commune here has a restaurant which they built by hand 100%. It was built with wood that they cut down from the land they have. The woodworking inside is spectacular because it is all done by the community and I spoke with the guys that did it. They were a long time building it but it is gorgeous. Some of the builders are from Quebec while is known to have a vibrant artisan population.

The hours of the restaurant are 7 to 7 so no all nighters. They close down on Friday night early (5 PM) to go home to prepare for the Friday night party. Saturday is their Sabbath and Sunday the restaurant is closed while they prepare for the week. The people didn't look overworked to me but maybe I am not looking closely enough.

They have moved around a bit as some communities were not economically viable, but they seem to like British Columbia as they have a number of communes.

As to whether they are running a slave operation, it didn't appear that way and we have gone out to their farm a few times.

I suspect that the different communities have their own flavour and I suspect that the Canadian ones are a bit different than the US ones. In fact when speaking to one guy, he said there was a big difference between the Canadian and US communes, simply due to the culture of the two countries. Canada tends to be more laid back.

As I mentioned we are not Christians so it wouldn't be apropos to go there anyways, but it seemed like such a great spot. As far as whether I got that it was a cult, well cult is a big word. It's definition depends on the person who utters it. Some people believe that since we meditate we are in a cult so go figure.

However I get what you say about issues in the community and when I asked the folks in charge they did say that some things can be difficult if say one person in a couple gets unhappy about the place, but then that happens when you live anywhere. They also seemed to know what is going on in the world and a lot of the people travel around to help other communities to set up.

A lot of the people that I talked to said they went there in their early twenties and have raised their families there and it is home. However I did not do an in depth study of the place.

I will check out the Sunrise Ranch but I won't move there either as a I am a dyed in the wool Canuck.

[cherimoya_kid]

There will probably never be anything such as a raw paleo community.  The people who are attracted to this diet are usually far too individualistic for such a thing.

[raw-al]

There will probably never be anything such as a raw paleo community.  The people who are attracted to this diet are usually far too individualistic for such a thing.

Probably would be difficult to gather enough people together to do it.

[Brad462]

i am not saying the folks in their community are not charming, nor are they lacking useful skills.  I think that, unless you are 100% down with their religion and also willing to work within their hierarchy(how do you think they have all of these amazing properties, buildings, cafes, boats, properties, they also have other outside businesses) they will ask you to get rid of all of your personal possessions and also contribute your money to them. 

Doesn't sound so bad actually unless you're materialistic and don't trust people.  I think I would rather give my money to this group than the government.